§ MR. HANBURYI beg to ask the Secretary of State for War what were the terms of the Reference to the Explosives Committee appointed 10th July, 1888, and dissolved in 1891; whether the War Office authorised such Committee to improve upon, or modify, as well as to examine, the private inventions submitted to them; whether, if so, all competitors, before submitting their inventions, were officially informed that their inventions were thus liable to be improved upon and modified, and these modifications be patented against them, or what information was given to them upon this point; how many private inventors sent in their inventions before the date at which Messrs. Abel and Dewar took out the first of their English patents, Nos. 5,614, 8,718, 11,664, and 11,667 of 1889; how many did so before these Members of the Committee, or either of them, took out a patent abroad, and were foreign patents so taken out or applied for in Germany, in Austria, in France, and in Belgium in 1889; were the inventors who submitted samples for competitive trial with each other, and with cordite a year later, in 1890, officially informed that two members of the Committee who were to judge upon them had previously patented cordite in their own names, both at home and in foreign countries; for what reason was the manufacture of cordite specially allowed to be kept a secret in this country, and for what period, after it had been disclosed to foreign manufacturers on the Continent; when did the War Office first become informed as to all the foreign patents, and by what means; what action did the War Office there- 634 upon take with reference to the application for, and the assignment of, foreign patents by its own officials for the manufacture and use abroad of its own secret explosive; and what steps has he yet taken to protect English inventors against any possible unfair competition of the War Office in future, or the War Office against having its secret processes or patents disclosed by its officials or otherwise, by means of foreign patents or other methods, to Continental Powers?
§ *MR. CAMPBELL-BANNERMANThe instructions to the Committee were general, and were as follows:—
The Committee is appointed for the purpose of considering questions relating to new explosive agents, or to new applications of or improvements in the production and application of known explosive agents, which will be referred to the Committee by order of His Royal Highness the Commander-in-Chief for consideration or investigation and report,and full directions were given as to carrying out these instructions. The Committee was appointed for three years, and during that period all explosives submitted to the Department, and all questions which arose relating to explosives were from time to time referred to the Committee for consideration and report. With regard to Questions 2 and 3 it was quite understood that the Committee were to endeavour by every means in their power to develop the science of explosives, and to place the Service in possession of those best adapted to meet its various requirements. The object of the Department was not to decide on the merits of rival inventions, but to obtain the best material for the Public Service. For this purpose the Committee were naturally entitled to suggest improvements and modifications, and no special intimation to that effect was required. In answer to Question 4, before 1888, when the Committee was appointed, many proposals had been submitted to the Department, the records in regard to which were accessible to the Committee. At the time the Committee was formed eight explosives were under consideration, and the investigations with regard to those were taken up by the Committee. Between that date and the date of the first application for patent by Messrs. Abel and Dewar eight others came under their consideration. I cannot give the information asked for in 635 paragraph 5. The Department has no particulars in regard to the taking out of the foreign patents. In answer to 6, the actual publication of the specification of the cordite patent was almost simultaneous with the arrangements for competition; hut the circumstances, and the fact of a patent having been applied for, were well known to all concerned. It is not accurate, by the way, to speak of the Committee judging the inventions; the Committee carried out the trials and reported the results, but were not the judges. With regard to Question 7, so far as its ingredients are concerned, cordite was not kept a secret. The only specification which was for a time sealed related to the form in which the material was to be produced. This was sealed from June 28, 1890, till May 28, 1892. But, as a matter of fact, the process of manufacture was disclosed in the specification for machinery published in July, 1890. I cannot answer as to the foreign patents, not knowing their dates. As to Question 8, Sir Frederick Abel informed the Director of Artillery, March 25, 1891, that he and Professor Dewar had transferred their foreign patents; but, as I have already said, the Department was not concerned as to those patents, and particulars were not asked for and were not communicated to the Department. With reference to Question 9, it was not considered necessary to take any steps, and the explosive was not a secret. In the last question the hon. Member assumes that there has been unfair action on the part of the War Office, and that its secret processes have been disclosed, neither of which assumptions appear to be supported by fact.
§ MR. HANBURYDo I understand the right hon. Gentleman to say, as a matter of fact, the secret of cordite was not disclosed to the German manufacturer when the patent was transferred to him? Is it a fact, too, that the transfer was not made known to the War Office till two years after it had actually taken place? Further, is it a fact that neither in 1888 nor in 1890 was any official intimation given to private inventors that the inventions submitted by them were liable to be improved upon by the War Office or that two members of the Ex- 636 plosives Committee had already taken out patents in foreign countries?
§ *MR. CAMPBELL-BANNERMANI have not said that they had already taken out patents. I am not aware of the dates. When my hon. Friend says the secret was disclosed at the time of the transfer of the foreign patents my answer is, You cannot disclose a secret when it is not a secret, and the principles and ingredients of cordite have never been a secret.
§ MR. HANBURYIs it not a fact that the patent was taken out in 1889, and transferred the same year, although the War Office were not informed of it till 1891.
§ *MR. CAMPBELL-BANNERMANI have quoted the dates given to me. My hon. Friend knows I have no personal cognisance of them, not having held an official position at the time. I do not think, however, the facts bear out the statement of the hon. Member.