§ MR. W. PRITCHARD MORGAN (Merthyr Tydvil)I beg to ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what are the names of the five mines which have paid royalties on gold obtained in Wales since 1885, and what are the respective amounts of royalties which have been paid by them; which of such mines are on private lands, and which are on Crown lands; what amount of money has been paid to the Woods and Forests Office since 1885, for dead rents and for solicitors' fees and charges respectively, for the 447 leases and licences to work for gold and silver in Wales since 1885; what is the minimum and what the maximum charge for dead rent on Crown lands and private lands respectively; and what is the minimum and what the maximum charge of the solicitor to the Woods and Forests for a lease to work for gold or silver on Crown lands and private lands respectively?
§ THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER (Mr. GOSCHEN, St. George's, Hanover Square)I will give the hon. Member the names of the mines so far as I am able to pronounce them. The names of the five mines and the royalties paid by them since 1885 are as follows:—Morgan Gold Mine, £1,574 4s. 3d.; Tynllwyn Gold Mine, 9s. 6d.; Castell Carn-dochan Gold Mine, £3 9s. 7d.; Gesel-cwm-Bach (parish of Llanelltyd), 2s. 10d.; Moel lspri (parish of Llanelltyd), 1838 4s. 4d. The first, third, and fifth of these mines are on private lands. As regards the third paragraph of the hon. Member's question, the payments for dead rents amount to £1,626, and those for solicitors' fees and charges to £1,528. The charge for dead rent depends upon circumstances, and the Commissioner of Woods does not bind himself to either a minimum or a maximum charge. The minimum charge for leases is £4; the maximum charge depends upon circumstances, but does not exceed that authorised under the Solicitors' Remuneration Act, 1881.
§ MR. W. PRITCHARD MORGANI should like to ask whether the right hon. Gentleman is aware that the Woods and Forests Commissioners charge as high as £25 or £30 for a nominal lease granted to a man to work gold on his own land?
§ MR. GOSCHENI am not able to give the information without notice. The hon. Member has not moved for the correspondence about the Morgan Mine; but if he moves I will lay it on the Table as I proposed on the 5th instant.
§ MR. FENWICK (Northumberland, Wansbeck)Would not more mines be worked but for the excessive royalties charged by the Crown?
§ MR. GOSCHENThat is a very interesting question. It is quite probable that if a less royalty were charged the persons who would otherwise pay the royalty would be able to sell their rights for a higher price to a company to work the mine. The result would be that the taxpayers would lose, while the particular person to whom the lease was given would be able to gain something better out of it. That has been the case in one or two instances.
§ MR. W. PRITCHARD MORGANI should like to know whether, out of the 447 leases granted by the Crown, only these five have been worked at all?
§ MR. GOSCHENI have given the hon. Member all the information with which I have been supplied.
§ MR. W. PRITCHARD MORGANI beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that the Chancellor of the Exchequer charges a royalty of 5 per cent, on gold obtained in Ireland; and whether he is prepared to recommend a reduction of such royalties, in conformity with the 1839 expressed desire of Her Majesty's Government to foster and encourage industries in Ireland, and in order to encourage those desirous of developing the mineral resources of Ireland?
§ MR. A. J. BALFOURThis is not a matter which has engaged my attention; but if the hon. Member will give me such information as will lead me to believe that there are gold mines in Ireland. I will undertake to look into the matter.
§ MR. J. O'CONNOR (Tipperary, S.)Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that, in comparison with its area, there has been a larger quantity of gold found in Ireland than in any other country in Europe; that from the discovery of gold in Wicklow in 1796 down to the destruction of the mines in 1798 the amount of gold produced equalled £10,000, and that during the first half of this century £100,000—
§ MR. SPEAKERThe hon. Gentleman is entering into an historical statement.
§ MR. SEXTONMay I ask whether the right hon. Gentleman deems it necessary to still maintain the royalties if he really doubts the existence of gold in Ireland?
§ MR. A. J. BALFOURA question as to royalty should be addressed to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, but what I am doubtful about is whether there are any gold mines in Ireland which would be worked if the royalty were abolished.
§ MR. J. O'CONNORLet me ask whether the right hon. Gentleman will bring this matter, say, before the Lord Lieutenant, with a view to reducing the royalties?
§ MR. W. PRITCHARD MORGANIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that the hon. Member for Cork has lately expended many thousands of pounds for the purpose of opening gold mines in Ireland, and is it not the fact that other persons have obtained leases from the Crown?
§ MR. A. J. BALFOURI do not know to which of the hon. Members for Cork the hon. Member refers. I have not heard that any of the hon. Members for Cork have spent thousands of pounds in order to seek for gold.