WAYS AND MEANS.—REPORT. (Hansard, 23 April 1888)

§ SIR JOHN SIMON (Dewsbury)
said, he wished to make a few observations before the Resolution was agreed to. He felt it his duty to call attention to the course which was being pursued by Her Majesty's Government, and upon grounds of public policy to protest against what practically amounted to a prohibition of the importation of French wines. The Prime Minister of France, on having his attention called to the 188 matter in the Chamber of Deputies, had indicated a possible course of retaliation if the duties on French wines were increased. He would, therefore, put it to the House whether it was wise or politic to increase this duty to a prohibitive degree, at a time, too, when we were asking France to remove the bounties on sugar? There was at the present moment a Conference sitting in this country upon the subject of the sugar bounties, and yet this was the moment selected by the Government for imposing prohibitive duty on French wines, a trade which had done much to increase the friendly feeling and commerce between the two countries. These duties, it was urged, were to be imposed as duties upon luxuries, and would only touch the rich No doubt the rich would continue to have their bottle of wine all the same; but those who contributed most largely to the Revenue were the middle classes, men of moderate means, who would not be able to indulge in the luxury of these wines if the duty be increased. He, therefore, thought it was unwise and impolitic to increase them under such circumstances, and he felt it his duty to protest against the Resolution. He could not allow himself to remain silent, and permit the Resolution to pass without this protest.

§ MR. W. E. GLADSTONE (Edinburgh, Mid Lothian)
Before any notice is taken from the Government Bench of the observations of my hon. and learned Friend behind me (Sir John Simon), I wish to say, on the part of myself and of those who sit near me, that if we do not enter into this subject at the present moment, it is only because there is a general understanding in the House that another subject has been marked out as the subject of debate to-night, and not at all on account of our taking a different view of the matter from that of my hon. and learned Friend. On the contrary, our opinion is that this question is one of the gravest character. I will not, however, detain the House at this moment by entering into it, as a full opportunity will be afforded on another occasion. Having said these very few words, I may add that several hon. Members on this side of the House will, at any rate, feel it their duty to support the view of my hon. and learned Friend when the question comes to be considered in Committee.

§ THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER (Mr. GOSCHEN) (St. George's, Hanover Square)
I quite agree with the right hon. Gentleman that it was understood that this was not to be the occasion on which the increased duty on wines was to be discussed, but that another opportunity was to be taken for discussing that matter. Of course, I am put in a position of some embarrassment by the observations of the hon. and learned Gentleman opposite (Sir John Simon), seeing that he has alluded to what has passed in Paris and in France generally. But I feel that it would be inconvenient to the House if I were to make any reply now to those observations. At the same time, I am bound to say that I entirely differ from the statements made by the hon. and learned Gentleman as to the effect of these new duties in France, and at the proper time I may have a good deal to say with regard to the arguments by which France justifies a protest against them. I also disagree with the hon. and learned Gentleman that this is a tax which will fall on the middle classes, because the enormous proportion of wine drunk by the middle classes either is or will be imported in casks.

§ SIR JOHN SIMON
said, he had referred to those classes of wines which were now consumed by the middle classes, but which would not in future be consumed by them.

§ MR. GOSCHEN
They will continue to be imported in casks.

§ MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR (Donegal, E.)
said, he would only detain the House for a moment, on account of the understanding that the discussion on wines would be taken later on. He, however, wished to ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer if the Government had yet obtained full information in regard to the amount of bottled wines imported from Italy and Greece; and whether he had considered the inequality of the taxation proposed to be imported as between the expensive wines of France and the more wholesome wines imported from the countries he had mentioned? He wished to know from the right hon. Gentleman whether, before the discussion was taken, the Government would obtain information from the Consular Authorities as to the amount of the bottled wines imported?

§ MR. GOSCHEN
said, there had already been laid before the House statistics as to the amount of wine imported both in bottles and in casks.

§ MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR
asked if the right hon. Gentleman would obtain further information from the Consular Authorities in Italy and Greece?

§ MR. GOSCHEN
I will do my best to obtain all such information as the House desires.

	£	s.	d.
If in imperial half-pint bottles or bottles of less capacity	0	1	3
If in bottles of capacity exceeding imperial half-pint bottles and not exceeding imperial pint bottles	0	2	6
If in bottles of capacity exceeding imperial pint bottles and not exceeding imperial quart bottles	0	5	0
If in bottles of capacity exceeding imperial quart bottles and not exceeding two imperial quarts	0	10	0
If in bottles of capacity exceeding two imperial quarts	1	0	0."