HC Deb 18 March 1887 vol 312 cc720-1
MR. COCHRANE-BATLLIR (St. Pancras, N.)

asked Mr. Chancellor of the Exchequer, Whether it is the intention of the Government to give a guarantee that the Civil Service writers employed on permanent duties shall receive the fixity of tenure which their work warrants, and that they shall be discharged only in case of misbehaviour or incompetence, thus relieving them of the necessity of being at the caprice of Heads of Departments, who are not in all cases disinterested parties; and, whether, if necessary, he will cause a Treasury Order to be issued to that effect?"

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER (Mr. GOSCHEN) (St. George's, Hanover Square)

I wish to take the opportunity which the Question of the hon. Member affords me to say that the Chairman of the Commission appointed to inquire into the condition of the Civil Service has informed me that the Com- mission will deal with the case of the writers. I must decline to give a guarantee of fixity of tenure to Civil Service copyists. Such a guarantee would contravene the principles regulating their entrance into the Public Service. Copyists are not dismissed by Heads of Departments. The power to dismiss them rests with the Civil Service Commissioners. When the Heads of Departments say that their services are no longer required they come again under the control of the Civil Service Commissioners, who decide the conditions of their future employment. Now, I wish to call attention to a phrase in this Question which ought not to have been introduced into it. I refer to the following words:— Thus relieving them of the necessity of being at the caprice of Heads of Departments, who are not in all cases disinterested parties. I am not aware of any ground justifying the sweeping allegation contained in those words. There are certain classes of Civil servants who are able to form themselves into large Associations, and by that means to exorcise considerable Parliamentary influence, to the detriment of the Public Service generally. The Heads of Departments have no such means of influencing public opinion; and they ought, therefore, all the more to command the support and consideration of the Government and Parliament when allegations of this kind are made.

MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR (Donegal, E.)

asked, whether it was a fact that during the last few weeks a very large number of copyists in different Departments had been removed by those over them from the work upon which they had been engaged for a considerable time, and had been put upon work properly described as copying? He also asked, whether the right hon. Gentleman would obtain from the Civil Service Commission a Return showing the work upon which copyists had been engaged during the last six months, such Return to be verified in each case by the copyists personally concerned?

MR. GOSCHEN

replied that the Royal Commission was inquiring into the case of the copyists. As the Commission had undertaken that duty, he was not disposed to interfere in the way suggested.