§ MR. STANLEY LEIGHTON (Shropshire, Oswestry)
asked the Chief Sec- 310 retary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, What is the sum total of the salaries and wages in the Civil Service proposed to be placed under the control of the Irish Executive by the Government of Ireland Bill; whether the following list correctly represents the offices and services which will be transferred from the Imperial to Irish control:—Board of Works, Chief Secretary's Office, Charitable Donations, Local Government Board, Grants in aid of Schoolmasters and Doctors, Public Works, Registrar General's Office, Record Office, Valuation and Boundary Survey, Law Charges, Supreme Court of Judicature, Court of Bankruptcy, Registry of Deeds, Registry of Judgments, Land Commissioners, County Court Offices, Reformatory Dundrum, Dublin Metropolitan Police, Constabulary, Constabulary Pensions, and Prisons; and, what is the total number of separate appointments for which provision is made in the Irish Civil Service Estimates?
§ THE CHIEF SECRETARY (Mr. JOHN MORLEY) (Newcastle-on-Tyne)
It is extremely difficult to answer as satisfactorily as I should like the inquiry of the hon. Member. In the first place, the Bill does not specify what branches of the Civil Service are to be transferred to the Irish Executive. In the second place, the continuance of branches will depend on the view taken by the Irish Executive of its own requirements. Then, again, it is not easy to define a Civil servant. However, I am disposed to think that the information which the hon. Member wishes to obtain would, as regards the permanent service as it stands now, subject to any special reservations in the Bill and exclusive, of course, of Customs and Excise, be generally interesting, and I shall be prepared to give the Return if it is confined to cases in which (1) the whole salary is now voted by Parliament; (2) the official's whole time is at the disposal of the public; and (3) the appointment carries pension or gratuity on discharge. These are the three limitations which, I think, constitute the definition of a Civil servant within the sense of the Question. The appointments might conveniently be classed in such a Return under three heads—(a) Heads of Departments, superior appointments, and clerical staff; (b) messengers and servants; and (c) any others.
§ MR. STANLEY LEIGHTON
Does the right hon. Gentleman refuse to give those local officers, subsidized by the Central Government, over which the Executive of Ireland would have power to withdraw the salary and dismiss the officer?
§ MR. STANLEY LEIGHTON
Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there are 3,000 of these local officers which will be under the authority of the Irish Executive?
§ MR. JOHN MORLEY
I was not aware. I will make a little further inquiry, and see if it is possible to include them in the Return, though I am doubtful about it.