§ MR. MONTAGU SCOTTasked the First Lord of the Treasury, What steps Her Majesty's Government have taken, or are about to take, to prevent the sudden capture of Herat?
§ MR. ASHMEAD-BARTLETTasked the First Lord of the Treasury, If his attention has been called to the important letter from the Correspondent of The Standard with Sir Peter Lumsden's Commission, and especially to the following passages:—
The importance to the Russians of acquiring Ak Tepe and Penjdeh district is obvious; the position gives them the command of the Kushk Rud and Murghab Valleys, of the passes leading across the mountains to the Herat Valley, and practically of Herat. With the control of these two valleys passes away the control of the Herat Valley; the advance by the Heri Rud, a much more difficult and inhospitable line, becomes unnecessary. The importance of the move to Pul-i-Khisti must be distinctly understood: it means the fall of Ak Tepe, the Penjdeh position, of the Kushk Rud and Murghab Valleys, and practically of Herat, to the Russians, and finally the solution of the Central Asian question in favour of Russia;and, what steps Her Majesty's Government are taking to counteract the injurious effect of General Komarofi's aggression upon the peoples of Central Asia?
MR. GLADSTONETo both these Questions I have to make one and the same reply; and my reply is that the matters named in both Questions have received the careful attention of Her Majesty's Government.
§ MR. ASHMEAD-BARTLETTCan the Prime Minister, consistently with the interests of the Public Service, inform the House whether it is true, as reported, that Her Majesty's Government have agreed to cede Penjdeh to the Russians?
§ SIR STAFFORD NORTHCOTECan the right hon. Gentleman give us any information as to the receipt of any further communications from Sir Peter Lumsden, and say whether he is in a position to affirm or deny the statement which has been made that a provisional Government has been established at Penjdeh by the Russian authorities?
§ MR. ARTHUR O'CONNORWill the right hon. Gentleman also inform the House whether there is any truth in the statement which appears in the evening papers to the effect that a large number of those who were with Sir Peter Lumsden's Commission had died from frost and hunger?
MR. GLADSTONEI may dispose of the last Question by pointing out that an answer has already been given by my noble Friend (Lord Edmond Fitzmaurice) on the part of the Government. With regard to the first Question of the right hon. Gentleman, we have had no further communication from Sir Peter Lumsden; and I think it may be of use to the House if I venture to warn hon. Gentlemen—not with reference to this or that particular communication—that there is a very great uncertainty indeed as to the time which is now required, either from St. Petersburg or London, to communicate with the officer on the spot. Partly we are uncertain, because we do not know precisely the state of the telegraphic communication from St. Petersburg, it being by no means established to our minds that there is a proper telegraph from St. Petersburg as far as Mery; and it likewise appears that the inclemency of the weather over that country has introduced a great deal of uncertainty, and from recent despatches from Sir Edward Thornton, dated the 11th of this month, I have an apprehension that we must be content to put up with some further delay before 1866 we can receive replies either from St. Petersburg with respect to the questions Her Majesty's Government have asked with reference to General Komaroff, or from Sir Peter Lumsden as to the important messages that have been sent to him, and which will in due time, no doubt, be fully answered by him. As to the Question of the right hon. Gentleman, all we know is this—there is a somewhat detailed statement in such evening papers as I have seen which purports to be from General Komaroff. With respect to the details and particulars of that statement we are not informed; but we have a telegram from Sir Edward Thornton, received this afternoon, which states in a very few words that an Administration—or a provisional Administration—has been, established in Penjdeh. So far, I think, I have answered all that was asked by the right hon. Gentleman. With regard to the inquiry whether it is true that Her Majesty's Government has undertaken to cede Penjdeh to the Government of Russia, the state of the case is this—that not only is that statement a statement without authority, but likewise I can assure the House that no assurances have been either given or received on the part of either Government on the subject of particular points upon the Frontier. There has been friendly conversation between Lord Granville and M. de Steal, with one or two present who were competent to assist them; but no assurances have been given which convey the intention of either Government with respect to particular points on the Frontier. I can only say that it was friendly conversation. Lord Granville has had frequent communications with the Russian Ambassador, as might naturally be expected during the critical circumstances of the last few days; but they have been of an unofficial character, except as regards certain matters of fact with respect to which it was his duty to make inquiry. I think that is all that has been asked me with regard to this question.
§ SIR WILLIAM HART DYKECan the Prime Minister inform the House whether Sir Edward Thornton in his despatch mentions by whom the Administration at Penjdeh has been formed?
MR. GLADSTONEHe does not mention it. His expression is "is estab- 1867 lished; "but I cannot doubt that it is established under Russian auspices, and I perceive that the detailed communication in the newspapers appears to be founded upon the necessity of establishing some Administration there after the disappearance of the Afghans from that district.
§ SIR MICHAEL HICKS-BEACHMay I ask the Prime Minister whether, in the course of the communications that have passed between the Russian Government and Her Majesty's Government, Her Majesty's Government have made any inquiry of the Russian Government as to the precise point in Central Asia to which their telegraph system extends; and, if so, whether there has been a reply?
MR. GLADSTONENo, Sir; we have not made inquiries of the Russian Government as to the state of its telegraphic communications, nor would it be very easy probably for them to give an exact reply, because the telegraph line to Merv is in course of construction, and they might not know at any particular moment how far it had proceeded. It will be observed that this very telegram in to-day's papers seems to have taken nine or 10 days in its transmission to St. Petersburg; and my impression is that no communication is at present passed between the Russian Government and General Komaroff in much less time than that, and therefore, of course, twice that time would be required for a reply.
§ MR. ASHMEAD-BARTLETTI beg to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether it is true that the Russian Government have asked or demanded that the zone of the debatable or debated land should be extended from Sari-Yazi, Pul-i-Khisti, and Penjdeh down to the Parapomesus Hills which skirt Herat on the North; and, also, whether he is aware that the Russian telegraph line is now finished as far as Sarakhs, within 100 miles of General Komaroff's headquarters, and that the attack of the 30th by General Komaroff was known at St. Petersburg on the 4th of April, and in Berlin on the 5th, whereas it was not communicated to this country until the 9th?
MR. GLADSTONEI have nothing to say as to what has been demanded by the Russian Government or by ourselves. With regard to the rest of the Question, 1868 I should have to thank the hon. Gentleman for giving me a great deal of information which I did not possess if I believed that he was accurately informed; but I do not believe that he is accurately informed on the points to which he has referred.
§ MR. BOURKEMay I ask the right hon. Gentleman, whether, in the conversation between the Russian Ambassador and Lord Granville, any suggestion has been made by the former that Penjdeh should be annexed to the Russian Empire?
MR. GLADSTONEI have not been present at these conversations. ["Oh, oh!"] Do I understand hon. Members to say that it is my duty to know everything that has passed in these conversations?
§ MR. ASHMEAD-BARTLETTCertainly, about Penjdeh.
MR. GLADSTONECertainly! If the law of manners had permitted the withholding of that interruption, I was about to say that I have no reason to believe that any such suggestion or demand has at the present time been made; and, as I have said, no assurances have been given or received by either Government.
§ MR. HEALYI wished to ask the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, whether there is any truth in the statement which appears in The Daily Telegraph this morning, to the effect that the Czar has sent a letter containing assurances of an extremely pacific character?
§ LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICEI did not see any such statement.
§ MR. HEALYThe following is the passage I refer to:—
I am charged by the personal commands of His Majesty the Czar to beg you to make known to the Government of the Queen that in the opinion of His Majesty a war would be deplorable for the two countries, and His Majesty hopes firmly that a prompt and simple arrangement will be established.
§ SIR HENRY HOLLANDsaid, that as great importance was attached to the exact date on which the information arrived at St. Petersburg from General Komaroff as to the Russian attack on the Afghans, he wished to know whether it was inconsistent with the nego- 1869 tiations now going on to instruct Sir Edward Thornton to learn on what date that information was received, either officially or otherwise?
MR. GLADSTONEI have no fear of being in error in saying that Sir Edward Thornton is himself convinced, and states it as his opinion, that the intelligence of the unhappy action at Pul-i-Khisti did not reach St. Petersburg until the evening of the 7th of April.