HC Deb 03 March 1884 vol 285 cc345-6
MR. JOSEPH COWEN

asked the President of the Board of Trade, If the following extract from his speech at Birmingham is correct:— When I was at Newcastle the other day the shipowners told me that over-insurance was altogether uncommon. It is not uncommon-I say it deliberately, speaking in the due sense of the responsibility, that it is the commonest thing in the world. I have overwhelming proof that in a great number of cases the loss of a ship is actually a source of profit to the owners. Why, even in Newcastle, I had an illustration of it. In the very short time I stayed there, I met a gentleman who said: 'A few days ago I was speaking to the manager of a large steamship company, and I asked him what sort of a season he had had, and his reply was, we have been very unfortunate, we have had no losses;' and, if so, whether he is able to substantiate that statement?

MR. CHAMBERLAIN

The extract from my speech to which my hon. Friend calls my attention appears to have been reported with substantial accuracy. He asked me whether I can substantiate this statement; but I find there are two statements in the extract, and I am not quite certain to which he refers. There is a statement that I had a conversation in Newcastle with a gentleman there, the purport of which I gave in my speech. As to the fact of my having had that conversation, I have nothing but my own word for it, which I hope my hon. Friend will think sufficient. There is also a statement that when I was at Newcastle the shipowners told me that over-insurance was altogether uncommon, &c. If it is with regard to this second statement that my hon. Friend puts this Question, I have to say that I have a great mass of information on the subject which I hope to lay before the House whenever I have an opportunity of moving the second reading of the Merchant Shipping Bill, and which, I believe, will carry conviction to every impartial mind.

MR. JOSEPH COWEN

I wish to explain that my Question was altered by the Clerk at the Table, and did not convey the meaning I had. What I wish to ask is, if the right hon. Gentleman could give us some information as to who the managing owner referred to in the speech is, because a person who does that is guilty of a criminal offence?

MR. CHAMBERLAIN

I have no information on that subject. The only information I have is contained in my speech. I repeated a conversation I had at Newcastle, as to which I do not think it necessary to give the name, and I have not myself the name of the managing owner to whom the gentleman with whom I had the conversation referred. I gave the conversation rather as an illustration than as a fact. ["Oh, oh!"] I gave it rather as an illustration of the opinion which is prevalent, even in shipping ports, concerning this subject, than as a fact upon which I was going to lay much stress.

SIR HERBERT MAXWELL

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that by concealing the name of this person, who, by his own confession, has been guilty of a criminal act, he is himself conniving at the offence?

MR. CHAMBERLAIN

I have already said that I do not know the name of the person.