HC Deb 26 June 1884 vol 289 cc1395-6
SIR HERBERT MAXWELL

asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether he can now give the House any information as to the present state of negotiations between Her Majesty's Government and that of the King of Portugal relative to the Congo River Territory?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

I have already stated in the House that on March 15 and June 1, 1883, Lord Granville informed the Portuguese Government that the Anglo-Portuguese agreement, if not accepted by the other Powers principally interested, would be futile, and that in consequence negotiations had commenced in order to ascertain the views of those Powers. Her Majesty's Government has now arrived at the conclusion that the objections taken by some of the Powers to certain portions of the Treaty are of too serious a character to leave any hope of the Treaty being accepted as a whole, and they have, therefore, informed the Portuguese Government that a ratification of the Treaty would be useless. It is, however, the hope of Her Majesty's Government to maintain that portion of the Treaty which relates to the River Commission, and, as originally proposed by them, to give it an International character. The powers it would have possessed under the Treaty were practically identical with those of the Danube Commission, from which it only differed in the composition of the controlling authority.

MR. O'DONNELL

The noble Lord says that the only difference between the proposed Commission and the Danubian Commission is in regard to the controlling authorities. But the difference of the originally proposed Commission on the Congo was that it was an Anglo-Portuguese Commission, while the Danubian Commission was an International one. Now, I understand that the Government propose to give up entirely the Anglo-Portuguese Commission, and that they are ready to accept an International Control of the mouth of the Congo.

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

Yes, Sir; that is perfectly accurate. The original proposal, which Her Majesty's Government supported till the end of the negotiations, was that the Commission should be of an International character. Therefore, in adopting that suggestion, we are reverting to the original proposal.

SIR. HERBERT MAXWELL

Is it intended that the powers of the River Commission should extend so far as to enable them to levy Customs duties?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

No; the River Commission, and all River Commissions made after the Treaty of Vienna, 1815, have nothing to do with Customs duties; they only deal with the navigation.

MR. BOURKE

Is the Government prepared to say that so much of the Treaty as remains—which is certainly a very important part—will not be ratified till the House has had an opportunity of coming to a conclusion upon it?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

No; I do not say that any part of the original question remains. What I said was that the idea contained in that clause of the Treaty would be maintained. There will have to be a fresh agreement of an International character.

MR. BOURKE

But will that be submitted to the decision of the House?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

The pledge which the Prime Minister gave on the subject last year referred to the Treaty between this country and Portugal; but this is a fresh matter, and I cannot answer the Question without Notice.

MR. BOURKE

said, he would put a Question on the subject on the Paper.