HC Deb 17 July 1884 vol 290 cc1402-5
MR. GOURLEY

asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, If he can now state what progress has been made in the negotiations of Her Majesty's Government with that of the Dutch for the purpose of promoting active operations on the part either of one or both Governments in obtaining the release of the captive crew of the Nisero?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

Her Majesty's Government have received a despatch to-day from Her Majesty's Minister at The Hague, conveying the assent of the Netherlands Government to the proposals made by Her Majesty's Government to secure the release of the crew. The proposals are as follow:—That the Rajah should be told that unless the captives be restored on a given day, Great Britain and the Netherlands would hold him and his people responsible, and proceed jointly to punish them; but that, in the event of his complying with their demand, it should be intimated to him that his ports would be re-opened to trade. He will also receive a money payment. Steps are being taken to carry out this arrangement with the utmost promptitude. Papers will be laid on the Table of the House.

MR. GOURLEY

There are two Questions I should like to ask upon that. One is with regard to the payment to be made to the Rajah, and the other is as to the amount which the Government would agree to award to the wives, widows, and families of the captive crew?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

I cannot make any further statement with regard to details as to what sum may be paid under certain circumstances to the Rajah. That is a matter which really lies more with the Dutch Government. In regard to the other Question of the hon. Member, I have been in communication with the Treasury; but I cannot state what the decision of the Treasury is.

MR. BROGDEN

asked what time would be given to the Rajah before steps were taken to secure the release of the captives?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

The reply of the Dutch Government was only received to-day; but steps are being taken, and probably by this time have been already taken, to adopt measures on the spot with a view to the plan agreed on between the Netherlands Government and Her Majesty's Govern- ment being put in practice at once. A great deal must naturally be left to the Local Authorities, and I hope in a few days to be able to make a further communication to the House as to the particular steps taken.

SIR JOHN HAY

asked why these steps, obviously so necessary, had not been taken sooner—before four of these unfortunate men had died?

MR. STOREY

Before the noble Lord answers that Question, I should like to ask him another. He states that one of the objects the Government had in view is to declare to the Rajah that his ports will be kept open. Do I understand that the British Government intend to give any guarantee to the Rajah that the ports will be kept open after they are opened?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

I do not think it would be advisable for me to enter into any statement of what steps will be taken in future eventualities. I have communicated to the House all it is in my power to communicate now—namely, the proposal made by Her Majesty's Government to the Dutch Government, and the reply that has been received thereto. In regard to the Question of the right hon. and gallant Baronet opposite, I do not think that I could answer that without raising a debate. The question was discussed the other day on the Motion for the Adjournment of the House by the hon. Member for Sunderland (Mr. Storey).

MR. STOREY

I do not think that the noble Lord apprehended the point of my inquiry. I asked him whether the British Government intends to give any guarantee to the Rajah that the ports shall be kept open, and for this reason—that, if I gather aright, the present proposals are exactly the same as those made by Mr. Maxwell in March, and rejected by the Rajah, because he would not take the word of the Dutch Government unless the English Government also gave a promise. I therefore wish to know whether it is proposed to offer to the Rajah the promise of the Dutch Government already rejected by him, or the promise of the English Government, which he desires?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

I think that it would not be desirable, in the interest of the success of these delicate negotiations, that I should at this moment enter into statements in regard to the details of the agreement between Her Majesty's Government and the Netherlands Government. These negotiations have been proceeding during the last few days, and the answer from the Dutch Government was only received by telegraph yesterday, and the despatch itself only a few hours ago. I do not in the least object to my hon. Friend asking this Question, which is very important, and which raises a point that will have to be borne in mind; but in the interest of the negotiations and of the captive crew I cannot undertake to answer the Question now.

MR. STOREY

I beg to give Notice that to-morrow I shall ask what are the exact offers made to the Rajah; and whether the noble Lord will explain, if he can, the difference in the proposals made now and the late proposals?

MR. BOURKE

The Papers will be presented to-morrow?

LORD EDMOND FITZMAURICE

Yes.

MR. BOURKE

Really, then, if the hon. Gentleman postpones his Question until the Papers are presented, I think it will be a good thing.