HC Deb 10 July 1884 vol 290 cc683-6
MR. HEALY

asked the Postmaster General, Whether the precedent in Corry Connellan's case is to be followed in regard to Mr. Cornwall's pension; if not, why; what is Mr. Cornwall's present official position; has he been dismissed; and, what is the "fuller information" which his Department are waiting for?

MR. FAWCETT

Mr. Cornwall, as I stated on Tuesday, has been suspended from duty. I think it will be expedient for me to defer coming to a final decision until the Law Officers have advised the Government upon the case. This being so, the point suggested in the first part of the hon. Member's Question does not arise.

MR. HEALY

Will the right hon. Gentleman kindly say when the Post Office Estimates are likely to come on?

MR. FAWCETT

I wish I could fix an early day.

MR. HEALY

asked the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, If the police are aware of the whereabouts of Mr. G. C. Cornwall, Secretary to the General Post Office; has he any announcement to make respecting the decision of the Law Officers regarding him; and, if not, when may it be expected?

MR. TREVELYAN

The police are aware of the whereabouts of Mr. Cornwall. I am not in a position yet to announce the decision of the Law Officers regarding him. The question whether the evidence in the case will sustain a criminal prosecution is one requiring careful consideration; but I may state that it is the intention of the Government to proceed against all persons against whom evidence is forthcoming.

MR. O'BRIEN

Mr. Speaker, I beg to give Notice that when the Vote for the salary of the Chief Secretary comes up for discussion I shall move that the Vote be disallowed.

MR. PARNELL

I beg to ask the right hon. Gentleman the Chief Secretary, whether, pending the decision of the Law Officers in the case of Mr. Cornwall, he has given directions to the police to prevent Cornwall from escaping beyond the jurisdiction of the Courts; and, whether his statement that it is intended to prosecute the persons against whom evidence can be obtained will include the witnesses in the recent trial by the evidence of whom Cornwall's guilt has been brought to light?

MR. TREVELYAN

The latter Question will have to be seriously considered by the Law Officers. With regard to the first Question, the police are watching Mr. Cornwall.

MR. PARNELL

The right hon. Gentleman did not answer my Question. Have the police orders to prevent Cornwall from escaping beyond the jurisdiction of the Courts? The right hon. Gentleman said the police are watching Cornwall; but I apprehend it is a very different thing to have orders to prevent him escaping from justice. I also wish to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether he is prepared to follow in this instance the course which the Irish Executive has pursued in the cases of the commission of felonies of another kind, and offer a reward for information with regard to the commission of crimes—[Mr. HEALY: £10,000]—coupled with a promise of pardon to accomplices, because I regard the statement which the right hon. Gentleman has made with regard to the witnesses in the late case as calculated to intimidate.

MR. TREVELYAN

Any reply as to who is going to be prosecuted or not coming from me before the Law Officers have examined the large body of evidence before them would tend rather to defeat than to further the ends of justice. The object and desire of the Government is to stamp out these odious crimes, whether committed by persons connected or unconnected with the Government. With regard to the Question whether the police have orders to prevent Mr. Cornwall leaving the country, it is very well known where he is at present. There are no legal means at present for arresting him, except a warrant is issued.

MR. HEALY

It is a felony, and no warrant is required.

MR. TREVELYAN

This only shows the extreme difficulty of discussing these matters across the Table in this way. One of the gravest questions is whether it is a question of felony. Till a warrant is issued the Government are perfectly satisfied that whenever Mr. Cornwall is wanted he will be found.

MR. O'BRIEN

The right hon. Gentleman did not answer the Question, which is, whether he can give any guarantee of the safety of the witnesses by whose evidence Cornwall's guilt was brought to light. I may say that, so far as the evidence I have—["Order, order!"]—

MR. SPEAKER

The hon. Member is out of Order in going beyond the limits of a Question.

MR. O'BRIEN

Then I ask the Chief Secretary whether he expects that I shall give him information before he gives me a guarantee as to the safety of the witnesses? For if he does, I may tell him that I will not trust either him or Earl Spencer with it. [Cries of "Answer, answer!" and Ministerial cries of "No, no!"]

MR. TREVELYAN

Sir, I may be Chief Secretary of Ireland; but I am an English gentleman—

MR. HARRINGTON

So was Cornwall.

MR. TREVELYAN

And if any hon. Gentleman, in putting a Question to me, tells me that under no circumstances whatever will he trust my statement, I shall not answer him.

MR. HARRINGTON

Arising out of the reply of the right hon. Gentleman, I wish to ask the Attorney General for England whether it is not legal for a policeman, in case he suspects a felony has been committed, to arrest that person, even without a warrant?

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL (Sir HENRY JAMES)

I think it better that such a Question should not be asked without Notice.

MR. PARNELL

I wish to ask the Chief Secretary whether Mr. Fitzgerald, of Cork, one of my constituents, was not arrested in the streets of London without a warrant, although he was neither accused nor sworn against.

MR. SPEAKER

This series of Questions is becoming quite irregular. The hon. Member for the City of Cork (Mr. Parnell) is now debating the Question. A Question can be asked, but a subject cannot be debated by a series of Questions.

MR. PARNELL

In explanation of the series of Questions I felt compelled to ask, I wish to say that the Chief Secretary has steadily declined to answer any one of them.

MR. HEALY

I wish to ask if the next time when a series of Questions is asked without Notice by the occupants of the Front Opposition Bench—[Cries of "Order!"]—

MR. SPEAKER

If these Questions continue, I shall be bound to take notice of them. I consider such a proceeding is quite out of Order.

MR. HEALY

I beg to say that the next time any right hon. Gentleman on the Front Opposition Bench asks without Notice a series of Questions—[Cries of "Order!"]—

MR. SPEAKER

I consider the terms of the Question of the hon. Member are not respectful either to the Chair or to the House.

MR. PARNELL

I beg to give Notice that I shall put further Questions on this subject to-morrow. [Cries of "Name!"]

MR. HEALY

Name away.