HC Deb 09 March 1883 vol 276 cc2018-20

(12.) £4,500, Superannuations and Retired Allowances.

(13.) Motion made, and Question proposed, That a sum, not exceeding £4,060, be granted to Her Majesty, to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March 1S83, to enable the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury to commute, under the provisions of the Act 36 and 37 Vic. c. 57, or otherwise, certain Annuities charged on the Exchequer.

MR. LABOUCHERE

said, he found that this Vote was— For the commutation of Annuities payable to the Duke of Norfolk; the Lord of the Manor of Taynton; the Minister of the Lutheran Chapel, lately in the Savoy; and the Keeper of St. Swithin's Gate, Winchester; and of a portion of the Annuity due to the heirs of the Luke of Schomberg; a nobleman who had now been dead a very long time. It seemed to him the Committee ought to refuse to grant this money. It had a suspicious appearance of having something to do with perpetual pensions. They would have to oppose the Vote unless they received some satisfactory explanation.

MR. COURTNEY

said, the annuity to the Duke of Norfolk was granted so long back as the time of Henry the Eighth. The Treasury was under an obligation to pay the annuity. The Duke of Norfolk, however, consented to commute it, so that the Treasury were enabled to buy it up and redeem it for a certain number of years. The sum in respect to the Manor of Taynton was very small indeed, only 30s. The allowance to the Minister of the Lutheran Chapel, in the Savoy, was £38, and was granted a long time ago out of the Consolidated Fund. They had been able to redeem the annuity at the rate of 10 years' purchase. The annuity to the Keeper of St. Swithin's Grate, Winchester, was £2 8s. 2d. The case of the Duke of Schomberg was certainly more serious. The annuity originally was £4,000 a-year. £2,616 of this had been redeemed at different times, and of the remainder it was now proposed to redeem £72.

MR. LABOUCHERE

said, he thought they could allow the money to the Lord of the Manor of Taynton, to the Minister of the Lutheran Chapel, and to the Keeper of St. Swithin's Gate. He should move, however, that the Vote be reduced by £3,948, which was the amount payable to the Duke of Norfolk, and the heirs of the Duke of Schomberg. He need not enter into any details as to the reasons why he proposed this reduction.

Motion made, and Question proposed, That a sum, not exceeding £112, be granted to Her Majesty, to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March 1883, to enable the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury to commute, under the provisions of the Act 36 and 37 Vic. c. 57, or otherwise, certain Annuities charged on the Exchequer."—(Mr. Labouchere.)

MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR

asked if the Financial Secretary to the Treasury would inform the Committee what was the nature of the grant made to the Duke of Norfolk in the Reign of Henry the Eighth, and whether it was a portion of the spoliation of the property of the Church which the present Duke of Norfolk, who belonged to that Church, was still enjoying?

MR. COURTNEY

said, there were two grants, one of £40, and the other of £20. The first was granted by Henry the Eighth, and the second by Richard the Third.

Question put.

The Committee dicided:—Ayes 9; Noes 53: Majority 44.—(Div. List, No. 25.)

Original Question put, and agreed to.