§
Motion made, and Question proposed,
That the Select Committee do consist of the following Members:—Mr. GLADSTONE, Sir STAFFORD NORTHCOTE, Mr. GOSCHEN, Mr. WHITBREAD, Sir JOHN MOWBRAY, Mr. RAIKES, Mr. ATTORNEY GENERAL, Sir HARDINGE GIFFARD, Mr. PLUNKET, Mr. PARNELL, Sir CHARLES FORSTER, Mr. SEXTON, Mr. JUSTIN M'CARTHY, Mr. DILLWYN, and Mr. HEALY:—Power to send for persons, papers, and records; Five to be the quorum."—(Mr. Gladstone.)
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI trust I may not be considered captious if I take exception to the list of names just read; but on looking over the names I find there are five—
§ MR. SPEAKERThe hon. Member is too late. I have put to the House each name as it was proposed by the right hon. Gentleman, and no objection has been taken to any single name.
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLMay I not move to add two names?
§ MR. SPEAKERThe hon. Member could not add any name without giving Notice.
§ MR. SPEAKERI called every name, and no objection was taken.
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI beg your pardon, Sir; I was on my legs the moment you read the name of the hon. Member for Wexford (Mr. Healy).
§ MR. SPEAKERThe hon. Member objects to the name?
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI only wish to suggest to the Prime Minister that it would be a graceful act on his part, as it seems to me, if he were to recognize the existence of certain constituencies North of the Tweed and their Representatives in this House. In doing so, Sir, I do not underrate or ignore in any degree the position of the Prime Minister himself as a Scottish Representative, nor do I forget his nationality; but we are accustomed to regard him in North Britain more in the light of the Leader of this House, and of Her Majesty's Government, than as the Representative of any particular district. In fact, we regard him somewhat as an 285 exotic in Scotland—or, if I may apply to him a somewhat musty quotation, we look upon him as
A creature all too bright and goodFor human nature's daily food.Therefore, it is in no sense of captious criticism that I venture to move an Amendment to this Resolution; and I beg to move that the last name, that of Mr. Healy, be omitted, and the words "Admiral Sir John Hay" inserted.
§ MR. SPEAKERIt will be open to the hon. Member to move the omission of the name of the hon. Member proposed; but he could not propose any other name without giving Notice.
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI beg to move the omission of the last name.
§ Motion made, and Question proposed, "That Mr. Healy be omitted."—(Sir Herbert Maxwell.)
§ MR. H. H. FOWLERBefore the Motion is put I venture to address a question of some importance to the Prime Minister—namely, whether he will undertake, before the Prorogation takes place, that we shall have an opportunity of discussing the Report of this Committee? The other night, when the Committee was moved for by the Prime Minister, he pointed out the obvious impropriety of a general discussion upon the facts of this unhappy incident. The House recognized the propriety of that suggestion and abstained from discussion; but the discussion was only postponed, not abandoned. I take it that this Committee will have to report to the House whether the circumstances under which the alleged contempt was committed justified the imprisonment of a Member of this House. I apprehend that the Report will necessarily provoke considerable discussion and differences of opinion. I think the question of the imprisonment of a Member of Parliament is quite as grave a matter as the Procedure of Parliament itself. Whatever our opinions may be, I carefully abstain from expressing any, although I feel very strongly upon it; but I venture to ask the Prime Minister whether the House will have an opportunity of discussing the Report, which, I venture to think, will be one of the most important ever presented with reference to the imprisonment of a Member of Parliament?
MR. GLADSTONEI venture to suggest to the hon. Gentleman that the question he has put had better stand over until probably the very early period at which this Report will be presented. He will understand the difficulty in which we are placed for the moment. I make the same admission to him which I made to the right hon. Baronet opposite (Sir Stafford North-cote) the other night, that there are certain questions which it may be the desire of the House to discuss before the Prorogation, and I likewise agree with him in the observation that the arrest of a Member of this House, if there be any matter in it which seems to call for attention, constitutes one of the subjects which must be considered; but the time is not yet come when any more positive answer can be given, and I hope my hon. Friend will allow the matter to stand over until the time does come when the Report is presented, which must come in a few days. I need not say that the Government having agreed to the list of names as they stand, of course, we shall vote upon the affirmative on the Motion which is now made of striking out the last name.
§ SIR STAFFORD NORTHCOTEI venture to suggest to the hon. Baronet (Sir Herbert Maxwell) amore satisfactory way of dealing with the matter—namely, that he should give Notice that he will move on Monday that the Committee should consist of an additional number of names, and that two additional names, the choice of Representatives of Scotland, should be added to the list. I think that will be a preferable course to the one proposed, to strike out the name of the hon. Member for Wexford (Mr. Healy).
MR. O'CONNOR POWERIn reference to the important point to which attention has been drawn by the hon. Member for Wolverhampton (Mr. H. H. Fowler), it occurs to me that unless the wording of the Resolution appointing the Select Committee be amended, we have no guarantee whatever that the Select Committee would make its Report before the close of the present Session. I do not know that it is in the power of the Government to exercise any pressure on the Select Committee. It will be a matter for the Select Committee itself to report or not before the close of the Session. Of course, looking at the names 287 which it is proposed should constitute this Committee, there are undoubtedly names on the Committee over whom the Government might naturally be expected to exercise influence; but they are not obliged to do that. If we are to have a discussion upon this very important subject, we ought to insert some words in the Resolution appointing the Committee requesting them to report before the close of the Session. I am not aware that that is usual; but really that must be done if we are to be assured of a discussion upon this important subject. In reference to the Amendment which has been proposed, I would ask the hon. Baronet who moved it whether it is worth while to press the Amendment to a division? I am not aware that the right hon. and gallant Admiral (Sir John Hay), who sits near me, has any particular desire to inquire into this question of Privilege. I am not aware that he considers that the hon. Member for Wexford (Mr. Healy) is a bit less qualified to pursue this investigation than himself; and, looking at the matter from that standpoint, and feeling that it is the general desire of the House that this Committee should be appointed without delay, and that we should have the result of its investigations as soon as possible, in order to afford us an opportunity of considering them, I hope the Amendment as to the list of names will not be pressed.
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI beg to withdraw my Amendment.
§ Motion, by leave, withdrawn.
§ Original Question put, and agreed to.
§ SIR HERBERT MAXWELLI beg to give Notice that on Monday I shall move that the name of Sir John Hay and a Scotch Liberal Member be added to the Select Committee.