HC Deb 10 February 1882 vol 266 cc376-7
SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF

asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether the subject of the communications that have passed through the agency of private individuals between Lord Granville and the Vatican has been embodied in Despatches to Her Majesty's Ambassador in Rome; and, if not, what steps Her Majesty's Government will take, in compliance with Constitutional practice, to record in such a manner as to be accessible to Parliament communications on public affairs carried on between one of Her Majesty's Ministers and a Foreign Potentate?

SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL

asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, If he has any objection to state the nature of the subjects respecting which Lord Granville communicated with the Vatican through a Member of this House, and to explain whether such communications imply any change in the policy of abstention from diplomatic intercourse with the Foreign Ecclesiastic whose residence is the Vatican?

SIR CHARLES W. DILKE

Sir, the hon. Member for Christchurch (Sir H. Drummond Wolff) seems to have framed his Question under some misconception of the facts. Sir Augustus Paget is accredited to the King of Italy, not to the Vatican. The Pope is the head of the Roman Catholic Church; but he has ceased to exercise temporal power. Mr. Aubin, Mr. Petre, Lord Lyons, Lord Ampthill, and Mr. Jervoise, in the active service of the diplomatic profession, were at various times instructed to reside at Home, in order to communicate officially with the Vatican. Mr. Jervoise was recalled in 1874, and his post ablished. Mr. Errington was not asked to go to Rome. He has received no appointment and no remuneration. He stated that he was going to stay there during the winter, and asked whether he could be of use to Her Majesty's Government. He was told that we had no negotiations to propose to the Pope, and no request to make of His Holiness. But there was information, on matters interesting Roman Catholics in the United Kingdom and in some of the Colonies, which might usefully be sent through a Member of good position in the House of Commons, who was so well known at the Vatican as himself. The Question of the hon. Member virtually is, why Her Majesty's Government did not transmit this information through Sir Augustus Paget. But the Vatican, rightly or wrongly, has a general objection to intercourse with the Representatives of foreign Powers accredited to the King of Italy.

SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF

said, he should, if possible, call attention to this question during the debate on the Address, and would give Notice that on Monday he would ask the Secretary of State for India, Whether any communications with the Papal See had taken place with reference to the appointment of Vicars Apostolic or other Prelates of the Roman Catholic Church in India, and whether such communications with the Papal See had taken place at the instance of the Viceroy of India; and, further, whether there had been any correspondence with the Viceroy respecting the appointment of additional Prelates; and, if so, whether such correspondence would be laid on the Table?

SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL

said, a direct answer had not been given to his Question. Might he assume that it was not intended to renew communication with the Pope, who no longer exercised territorial jurisdiction?

SIR CHARLES W. DILKE

said, he adhered to the terms of his answer. He stated that there had been no appointment and no salary. On Mr. Jervoise's recall in 1874 the post was abolished, and there was no intention to re-create it.