CUSTOMS AND INLAND REVENUE BILL.— [BILL 136.] (Hansard, 27 May 1881)

§ SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF
said, that he had been prevented from bringing on his Motion with respect to the heavy duty on tobacco. He should not bring it on this year; but he hoped the Chancellor of the Exchequer would con- 1462 sider the high duties on tobacco, and make some modification.

§ SIR STAFFORD NORTHCOTE
said, he wished to put a question to the Chancellor of the Exchequer on a point as to which there had been some little misunderstanding. His right hon. Friend had stated in his Budget speech that, as regarded Probate Duty, the question of settled property was a difficult one; that it was unreasonable that heavy Probate Duty should he levied on unsettled property, while a duty of 5s. only was levied on settled property; but that he had looked carefully into the question and found that it was so mixed up with the question of real estate that it was impossible to deal with it except as a separate matter. But there was a clause in the Bill which had caused some anxiety. That was the 39th clause, which, among other things, made property subject to a voluntary settlement liable to Probate Duty. He wished to know if the effect of those words was to make settled property subject to the duty; or, as he rather supposed, was weight to be given to the word "voluntary," so that marriage settlements should not be included? It was desirable to have the point cleared up.

MR. GLADSTONE
said, he thought the question entirely beyond doubt. The construction suggested by his right hon. Friend was perfectly correct. Voluntary settlement was dealt with because that sort of settlement, with a reserve power to the settler to revoke it and resume possession, was, as the Treasury conceived, a complete evasion. He hoped that his Amendment in Clause 9, which, in place of testing by Sykes's hydrometer, provided that— A sample of such spirit may be distilled or treated by such other process as the Commissioners of Customs shall direct, so that the true strength of the spirit may be ascertained by the said hydrometer, would be accepted. It did not correspond in terms with the engagement he gave to the House, though he would hold to the engagement if it were insisted on. He wished the House to understand that they were carrying out the spirit of the engagement. The testing with a view to the duty would still remain to be carried on by the criterion of the instrument known as Sykes's hydrometer, as it had always been, and 1463 the only new power given to the Department was to enable them to direct means for clearing the commodity which was to be valued, and bringing it into a proper state for distillation. He was bound to say that he thought the clause stood better as it did now, because this duty of arranging means for bringing spirit into a state for distillation was an executive and administrative duty strictly belonging to the Department.

§ SIR JOSEPH M'KENNA
considered the Amendment not only suitable, but needful. The hydrometer was, no doubt, a highly efficient instrument, but not universally operative. For instance, if applied to liquors, the specific gravity of which was affected by the presence of sugar, the hydrometer would not show their true alcoholic strength; and an Amendment such as that now proposed was requisite to permit another testing process to be adopted in such cases—for example, distillation, which it was the practice to apply at present for testing the strengths of wines.

§ MR. WARTON
considered the objectionable feature in the clause to be the words "or otherwise;" and he, therefore, suggested to the Prime Minister that they should be omitted.

§ LORD FREDERICK CAVENDISH
was quite willing to accept the suggestion; but he proposed that the words "direct will be sanctioned" should be inserted.

CAPTAIN AYLMER
said; that he had suggested the Amendment in the first instance, and was glad that the right hon. Gentleman had adopted it. He would, however, move to insert, after the, word "process," "as should have been previously approved by the Treasury, and notified to the trade."

MR. GLADSTONE
said, he thought he could persuade the hon. and gallant Member that this Amendment was a most unwise one from his point of view. If they were to specify in the case of a particular measure that the regulations would be made known to the trade, others would have to be made known.

§ MR. WARTON
contended that all the evil lay in the words "or otherwise," and would again suggest that they should be left out.

§ MR. CHILDERS
pointed out that the strength of the spirit would be decided by the hydrometer; but it might be necessary, at the same time, to remove certain impurities before it could be so tested. The real test, however, about which the trade was anxious, was preserved in its entirety.

§ MR. WARTON
begged to draw attention, in Clause 39, line 23, to the words "donation mortis causâ." It was his opinion that they should speak either English or Latin; and, therefore, he proposed that the word "donatlo" should be substituted for the word "donation." The First Lord of the Treasury was so good a scholar that the alteration must recommend itself to the right hon. Gentleman.

MR. GLADSTONE
said, that he was grateful to the hon. and learned Member for the suggestion which he had made.