CONSIDERATION THIRD READING. (Hansard, 22 August 1881)

§ MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR
said, there was one question he wished to ask the noble Lord in reference to the officials who were to be transferred from the employment of the Church Commission to the Land Commission. He did not know how many they were in number; but he understood that there was only 704 a small amount of work yet to be done in connection with the Church Commission, and it was principally in connection with the collection of monies to be paid for land and other property. He wished to ask how many members of the present staff would be sufficient to perform the work which yet remained to be done, and how many of them were likely to be transferred to the Land Commission? Secondly, he wished to know what pensions the officials whose services would be dispensed with would hereafter receive when the collection of monies was wound up, and they had nothing more to do? He also wished to know how the pensions would be provided for, and whether any charge in connection with them would fall on the Land Commission?

§ LORD FREDERICK CAVENDISH
thought the hon. Gentleman (Mr. Arthur O'Connor) rather underrated the amount of work to be done. He (Lord Frederick Cavendish) believed that there was still a large amount of work remaining to be done. At present, it was impossible to say how many clerks would be required for the Land Commission, or what staff would be considered necessary. In respect of pensions, all pensions which were legally obligatory would, he presumed, fall upon the funds at the disposal of the Commissioners of Works.

§ MR. CALLAN
asked if the noble Lord was able to say by what date the Land Commission would be completed, and if it was intended to put any pressure upon them in order to compel them to take the staff of the Church Commission? If the Land Commission, for instance, only required 20 clerks, would they be called upon to take 20 out of the staff of the Church Commission, or would they be left free to make their own selection? His own opinion was that the Land Commission should be left perfectly free and independent, and that they should not be required to give a preference to these particular clerks over other ordinary clerks in the Civil Service. If it was not intended that the Land Commission should take over the clerks of the Church Commission, would the Government make a statement to that effect explicitly, and leave the Commission to make their own selection without being fettered in their choice? He was satisfied that if it was intended to compel the Land Commission to take 705 over the clerks of the Church Commission, it would give great dissatisfaction in Ireland, and would be looked upon as calculated to impair the working of the Land Commission. If all the staff were selected from one class, it would be thought that the Commission would assume more or less of a partizan character. It was necessary, for the future independence of the Land Commission, and in order to give the Irish people full confidence in their operations, that they should be free and unfettered altogether in the selection of their officers, and that they should not be bound in any way to take over the officers of any other establishment.

§ LORD FREDERICK CAVENDISH
said, the Land Commission would have no interest in taking over the officers of the Church Commission, except so far as they were satisfied that such officers would be able to do the work, and it might be considered desirable to employ them, the revenues of the Church Commission being, in some respects, coextensive with those of the Land Commission, and it being therefore unwise to change the staff. The responsibility of selecting the staff necessary for carrying on the work of the Commission would rest with the Commission itself.

§ MR. CALLAN
asked if the clerks now in the employment of the Church Commission would only be selected for the purpose of continuing the work of the Church Commission, and not for the purpose of conducting the new business of the Land Commission?

§ MR. SPEAKER
said, the hon. Member was travelling wide of the Question before the House, which was that the Irish Church Act Amendment Bill be now read the third time.