HC Deb 27 August 1880 vol 256 cc467-70

Considered in Committee.

(In the Committee.)

MAJOR NOLAN

wished to ask a Question about the information which had been given some time ago by the late Under Secretary of State for War. He should like to know whether there were not yet a large number of muzzle-loading guns still being made at Woolwich Arsenal. There were a very few officers in the Army who had considered the question; but it appeared to him to be utter folly for the Government to be still manufacturing muzzle-loading guns. If that course was still being adopted, he would like to know what guns were being made?

MR. CHILDERS

was not quite sure whether it was in Order to go into the question on the present occasion, as the Vote was only for the adjustment of the Navy accounts. But he might state that certain experiments in breech-loading guns were being made, and the question between the muzzle and breech-loading guns was under the fullest consideration. The hon. and gallant Member would not, under these circumstances, expect him to express any opinion on the question he had raised. He did not propose to make any statement to the House until next Session.

MAJOR NOLAN

hoped the right hon. Gentleman would have an opinion next Session, and that he would refer to the subject. It was absolutely necessary for the Government to have an opinion upon it.

MR. CHILDERS

said, that, in moving the Estimates next year, he would state very fully the views of the Government. No one attached greater importance to the subject than himself.

1. Resolved, That it appears by the Navy Appropriation Account, for the year ended 31st March 1879, that the balances unexpended in respect of Votes for Navy Services for the said year amounted to the sum of£367,878 16s. 6d., viz.—

£ s. d.
Vote 2. Victuals and Clothing for Seamen and Marines 107,166 4 10
Vote 3. Admiralty Office 3,559 7 10
Vote 4. Coast Guard Service and Royal Naval Reserves. 20,522 9 0
Vote 5. Scientific Branch. 6,907 12 0
Vote 6. Dockyards and Naval Yards at Home and Abroad 1,629 1 4
Vote 7. Victualling Yards at Home and Abroad 1,240 14 3
Vote 9. Marine Divisions 321 8 9
Vote 10. Naval Stores, &c—
Section 1. Naval Stores 44,216 0 0
Section 2. Steam Machinery, &c. 143,857 1 8
Vote 11. New Works and Repairs 10,353 1 11

£ s. d.
Vote 12. Medicines and Medical Stores. 3,142 14 5
Vote 13. Martial Law and Law Charges 285 7 2
Vote 15. Half Pay, &c. 13,715 8 4
Vote 16. Military and Civil Pensions, &c.:—
Section 1. Military Pensions and Allowances. 8,791 17 10
Section 2. Civil Pensions and Allowances. 2,170 7 2
£367,878 16 6

2. Resolved, That the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury have temporarily authorised the application of£197,116 14s. Id. out of the said total sum of£367,878 16s. 6d., to provide for the expenditure incurred in excess of certain other Votes for Navy Services for the said year, viz.:—

£ s. d.
Vote 1. Wages of Seamen and Marines 37,143 15 9
Vote 8. Medical Establishments at Home and Abroad 487 7 1
Vote 14. Miscellaneous Services 4,516 3 4
Vote 17. Army Department (Conveyance of Troops) 153,242 2 0
Balances irrecoverable. 1,727 5 11
£197,116 14 1

3. Resolved, That the said application be sanctioned.

4. Resolved, That it appears by the Army Appropriation Account, for the year ended the 31st March 1879, that the balances unexpended in respect of certain Votes for Army Services for the said year, amounting to the sum of£160,808 13s. 1d., were as follows, viz.:—

£ s. d.
Vote 5. Militia Pay and Allowances 56,097 6 4
Vote 6. Yeomanry Cavalry. 1,658 17 7
Vote 8. Army Reserve. 51,432 12 4
Vote 13. Works, Buildings, and Repairs at Home and Abroad 23,120 9 0
Vote 14. Establishments for Military Education. 2,784 6 0
Vote 15. Miscellaneous Services. 2,118 6 0
Vote 16. Administration of the Army. 7,674 1 5
Vote 20. Widows' Pensions, &c 2,606 19 5
Vote 21. Pensions for Wounds 735 11 8
Vote 22. Chelsea and Kilmainham Hospitals. 495 10 10
Vote 24. Superannuation Allowances. 10,321 7 10
Vote 25. Militia, Yeomanry Cavalry, and Volunteer Corps 1,763 4 8
£160,808 13 1

5. Resolved, That it further appears from the said account that the sum of£271,495 18s. 5d. was realised in the said year in excess of the estimated Appropriations in Aid.

6. Resolved, That the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury have temporarily authorised the application of the said sums, amounting together to the total sum of£432,304 11s. 6d., to provide in part for the following amounts of expenditure incurred in excess of certain other Votes for Army Services for the said year, viz.:—

£ s. d.
Vote 1. General Staff and Regimental Pay. 46,998 4 6
Vote 2. Divine Service 2,839 7 4
Vote 3. Martial Law. 127 3 4
Vote 4. Medical Establishments and Supplies. 22,007 4 7
Vote 7. Volunteer Corps 1,478 6 6
Vote 9. Commissariat, &c Establishments. 36,061 8 5
Vote 10. Provisions, Forage Fuel, &c. 463,310 9 1
Vote 11. Clothing Establishment, &c. 79,229 12 9
Vote 12. Supply, &c. of Warlike and other Stores. 39,627 8 10
Vote 17. Rewards for distinguished Services 1,838 11 9
Vote 18. Pay of General Officers 967 14 0
Vote 19. Full Pay of Retired &c. Officers and Half Pay. 31,724 14 7
Vote 23. Out Pensions. 50,733 2 1
Amounts written off as irrecoverable 870 17 0
Amount disallowed on the Army Appropriation Account 1876–7, on account of Purchase of Land at Malta 2,714 10 0
£780,528 14 9

7. Resolved, That the said application be sanctioned.

Resolutions to be reported To-morrow.