HC Deb 08 April 1870 vol 200 cc1583-7

SUPPLY—considered in Committee.

(In the Committee.)

MR. STANSFELD

said, that a Vote on account, within certain limits, had become a matter of necessity since the abolition of the system of holding over a balance from one year to another. The sums voted for men in the Army and Navy Estimates were available for other items of expenditure in those Estimates, subject to the subsequent approval of the House of Commons; but as there was no such dominant Vote in the Civil Service Estimates, he was reduced to the necessity of asking for a Vote on account. The Vote on account had in its favour the fact that it simply committed the House to the expenditure of a limited sum of money on account of the Service, without determining the amount of any particular Vote; it left the House, in fact, as independent as if no Vote had been passed. But he wished to explain that the Vote he asked for was for about two months and a-half, which, though less than the ordinary four months' Vote on account of some years past, was more than the Vote on account taken during the last two Sessions. The very limited Vote of two months, however, had this disadvantage, it had to be supplemented by another Vote on account, before the Votes could be dealt with in full. Considering the amount of business before the House, he believed there was no reasonable prospect of being able to consider the Civil Service Estimates before the expiration of upwards of between two and a-half and three months, and he therefore asked for a Vote to cover that time—namely, for £2,323,000.

MR. DILLWYN

said, he did not object to the Vote, but that the amount fixed was larger than the necessity of the case required. The Civil Service Estimates were increasing in amount, and full opportunity of discussing them should be given. No doubt there was much business before the House; but these Estimates ought not to be delayed so late as July, when there was only a scanty attendance of Members. He therefore begged to suggest, as an Amendment, that the Vote on account should be reduced by the sum of £600,000, which would reduce it to two months' supply. If the hon. Gentleman found, at the expiration of the period which this Vote would cover, that the Civil Service Estimates would not be reached in time, no doubt the House would readily grant a further sum on account.

MR. SCLATER-BOOTH

said, it would not be to the convenience of the House, and certainly not to the advantage of the public service, that the Amendment should be carried. He had experienced the inconvenience of a Vote on account for two months. A Vote for throe months would carry on the public service only to the month of June, and certainly some progress must be made with the Civil Service Estimates before the Vote on account was exhausted. The objection to postponing the Civil Service Estimates to a late period of the Session was a subject worthy consideration at a future time, but could not be urged as against this Vote. He therefore hoped the Amendment would not be pressed. With regard to the total amount, he might add that the Secretary to the Treasury was wrong in claiming a reduction in this year's Estimates, because, instead of comparing them with the Estimates of last year, he had compared them with the actual grants, without considering the Supplementary Estimates with which he would come to the House before the Session was ended; and he (Mr. Sclater-Booth) noticed that these Civil Service Estimates were, in fact, an increase as compared with those of the year before last.

MR. STANSFELD

said, he wished to remind the hon. Member for Swansea (Mr. Dillwyn) that this Vote ought to be sufficient to meet the requirements until some actual progress had been made with the Estimates. He agreed with his hon. Friend opposite (Mr. Sclater-Booth) in the opinion that the Estimates should be compared with the corresponding calculations of the original Estimates of the previous year; but he had simply followed the rule of those who had preceded him, including his hon. Friend.

MR. DILLWYN

said, he would withdraw his Amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. Resolved, That a sum, not exceeding £2,323,000, be granted to Her Majesty, on account, for or towards defraying the Charge for the following Civil Services, to the 31st day of March 1871: viz.

Class I.
Great Britain:— £
Royal Palaces … … … 8,000
Royal Parks … … … 25,000
Public Buildings … … … 30,000
Furniture of Public Offices … … 4,000
Westminster Palace, Acquisition of Land … … … … 12,000
Houses of Parliament … … 8,000
Public Offices' Site … … 4,000
New Home and Colonial Offices … 20,000
Public Record Repository … … 9,000
Chapter House, Westminster … 1,500
Sheriff Court Houses, Scotland … 3,500
National Gallery Enlargement … 5,000
University of London Buildings … 4,000
Glasgow University … … 5,000
Edinburgh Industrial Museum … 2,500
Burlington House … … 14,000
Post Office and Inland Revenue Buildings … … … … 38,000
British Museum Buildings … … 4,000
County Courts Buildings … … 15,000
Science and Art Department Buildings 10,000
Surveys of the United Kingdom … 30,000
Harbours of Refuge … … 10,000
Portland Harbour … … 1,000
Metropolitan Fire Brigade … … 2,500
Rates on Government Property … 9,000
Wellington Monument … … 250
Ireland:—
Public Buildings … … … 36,000
Ulster Canal … … … 1,000
Abroad:—
Lighthouses Abroad … … 4,000
Embassy Houses: Paris and Madrid 750
Embassy Houses and Consular Buildings: Constantinople, China, Japan, and Tehran … … … 15,000
Class II.
England:—
House of Lords, Offices … … 11,000
House of Commons, Offices … 12,000
Treasury and Subordinate Departments 15,000
Home Office and Subordinate Departments … … … 21,000
Foreign Office … … … 16,000
Colonial Office … … … 8,000
Privy Council Office and Subordinate Departments … … … 12,000
Board of Trade and Subordinate Departments … … … 25,000
Privy Seal Office … … … 700
Charity Commission … … 4,000
Civil Service Commission … … 3,000
Copyhold, Inclosure, and Tithe Commission … … … 5,000
Copyhold, Inclosure, and Drainage Acts Expenses … … … 2,000
Exchequer and Audit Department … 9,000
General Register Office … … 11,000
Lunacy Commission … … 5,000
Mint … … … … 10,000
National Debt Office … … 4,000
Patent Office … … … 8,000
Paymaster General's Office … 5,000
Poor Law Commission … … 50,000
Public Record Office … … 5,000
Public Works Loan Commission … 1,000
Registrars of Friendly Societies … 700
Stationery Office and Printing … 100,000
Woods, Forests, &c, Office of … 7,000
Works and Public Buildings, Office of 9,000
Secret Service … … … 6,000
Scotland:—
Exchequer and other Offices … 1.000
Fishery Board … … … 3,000
General Register Office … … 2,000
Lunacy Commission … … 1,500
Poor Law Commission … … 4,500
Ireland:—
Lord Lieutenant's Household … 1,500
Chief Secretary's Office … … 6,500
Boundary Survey … … … 100
Charitable Donations and Bequests Office … … … … 500
General Register Office … … 5,000
Poor Law Commission … … 25,000
Public Record Office … … 1,000
Public Works Office … … 6,500
Class III.
England:—
Law Charges … … … 11,000
Criminal Prosecutions … … 60,000
Chancery Court … … … 40,000
Common Law Courts … … 15,000
Bankruptcy Court … … 20,000
County Courts … … … 50,000
Probate Court … … … 22,000
Admiralty Court Registry … … 3,000
Land Registry Office … … 1,500
Police Courts, London and Sheerness 6,000
Metropolitan Police … … 54,000
County and Borough Police, Great Britain … … … 50,000
Government Prisons, England, and Transportation and Convict Establishments in the Colonies … 120,000
County Prisons and Reformatories, Great Britain … … … 75,000
Broadmoor Criminal Lunatic Asylum 9,000
Miscellaneous Legal Charges … 4,500
Scotland:—
Criminal Proceedings … … 18,000
Courts of Law and Justice … … 14,000
Register House Departments … 7,000
Prisons … … … … 6,000
Ireland:—
Law Charges and Criminal Prosecutions … … … … 19,000
Court of Chancery … … 11,000
Common Law Courts … … 7,000
Court of Bankruptcy and Insolvency 2,000
Landed Estates Court … … 3,000
Probate Court … … … 3,000
Admiralty Court Registry … … 500
Registry of Deeds … … 3,500
Registry of Judgments … … 750
Dublin Metropolitan Police … 25,000
Constabulary … … … 200,000
Government Prisons and Reformatories 12,000
County Prisons … … … 11,000
Dundrum Criminal Lunatic Asylum … 1,500
Four Courts Marshalsea Prison … 650
Miscellaneous Legal Charges … 2,000
Class IV.
Great Britain:
Public Education … … … 200,000
Science and Art Department … 40,000
British Museum … … … 22,000
National Gallery … … … 4,000
National Portrait Gallery … … 500
Learned Societies … … 3,000
University of London … … 2,000
Endowed Schools Commission … 3,000
Universities, &c. in Scotland … 4,250
Board of Manufactures, Scotland … 500
Ireland:—
Public Education … … 120,000
Commissioners of Education (Endowed Schools) … … … 200
National Gallery … … … 500
Royal Irish Academy … … 400
Queen's University … … 800
Queen's Colleges … … … 1,000
Class V.
Diplomatic Services … … 50,000
Consular Services … … 50,000
Colonies, Grants in Aid … … 12,000
Orange River Territory and St. Helena 1,000
Slave Trade, Commissions for Suppression of … … … 1,000
Tonnage Bounties, &c. … … 7,500
Emigration … … … 3,000
Coolie Emigration … … 250
Treasury Chest … … … 4,000
Class VI.
Superannuation and Retired Allowances 100,000
Merchant Seamen's Fund Pensions, &c. 11,000
Relief of Distressed British Seamen … 9,000
Hospitals and Infirmaries, Ireland … 4,000
Miscellaneous Charitable Allowances, &c. Great Britain … … 1,500
Miscellaneous Charitable Allowances, &c. Ireland … … … 1,500
Class VII.
Temporary Commissions … … 8,500
Local Dues on Shipping … … 11,000
Malta and Alexandria Telegraph, &c. 200
Flax Cultivation, Ireland … … 500
Miscellaneous Expenses … … 1,500
Total … £2,323,000

House resumed.

Resolution to be reported upon Monday next;

Committee to sit again upon Monday next.