SUPPLY—considered in Committee. (Hansard, 16 July 1868)

§ GENERAL DUNNE
called attention to the Report of the Committee on the Military Reserve Funds; and referred to the several schemes suggested for promoting retirement among officers of the Royal Artillery and Engineers, contending that the inducement to be offered to officers to retire should be equal to their hopes if they remained in the corps. The system of purchasing out the officers of the Engineers and of the Artillery with sums from a reserve fund to which they never had contributed was a most objectionable one, and had been condemned by a Committee who had gone very fully into the subject. He hoped that the right hon. Gentleman the Secretary for War would inform the House that they were going to put an end to this mode of purchasing out officers, and to do something towards carrying out the recommendations of the Committee on the subject.

§ MR. CHILDERS
, while admitting that the subject was a difficult one, and while not blaming the Government, thought at the same time that it was very unfortunate the War Department had not come to a decision in reference to the recommendations of the Committee to which the hon. and gallant General (General Dunne) had just referred. On the other question, nothing could be worse than the system under which the officers of non-purchase corps were now retired. A fixed sum was provided, out of which officers of a certain standing might or might not, according to their rank, receive annuities of £600 or £450 a year; but it was a farce to call this a system of retirement. The Committee recommended that there should be a fixed scale according to length of service, and that officers should be allowed to compound for the payments to 1279 which they would be entitled. The only thing the House had got before them in reference to the intentions of the Government was a Paper, drawn up by the actuaries and based upon speculations entirely gratuitous, as far as the Committee were concerned, on the part of gentlemen in the War Department and at the Horse Guards. It was true that some of these gentlemen came before the Committee, and the Committee had heard some of these speculations; but they never even alluded to them in their Report; and the Paper was perfectly useless so far as the House might want it. He must therefore disregard it as an authority in the discussion of the question. Even according to the view of the parties themselves the scheme was so absurd that it was impossible for reasonable men to deal with it. He hoped, seeing what ideas were in vogue in his office, that his right hon. Friend the Secretary for War would not commit Parliament and the country to any change in the present arrangements till next Session.

§ SIR JOHN PAKINGTON
, in reply to the observations of the hon. and gallant Member (General Dunne), with reference to the reserve fund, said, that as the change involved in the Report of the Committee was a very important one he thought the best course to adopt, looking to the interests of the army was to consider it during the Recess. He had therefore applied to the Treasury and had obtained their sanction to deal with the reserve fund exactly as heretofore up to the time when the Estimates would be introduced nest year. By that time the Government would have made up their minds as to the course which they would be prepared to lake in reference to the fund. As to the observations which had fallen from his hon. Friend the Member for Pontefract (Mr. Childers), he could only repeat what he had already stated, that it would be absolutely necessary before long to have a new plan of retirement for the non-purchase corps. The questions involved, however, were very complicated and difficult, and it was far more important that any scheme which was devised should be well done than that it should be done quickly. He would assure his hon. Friend (Mr. Childers) (hat no premature action would be taken upon the subject to which he referred, and that nothing would be done without the sanction of Parliament. He hoped the House would he content with his assurance that during the Recess he should give further consider- 1280 ation to the subject. There was in the Vote they were about to pass a sum of £5,000, being the second instalment of £10,000 for the Engineers; did the hon. Gentleman wish that that £5,000 should not be expended as was intended.

§ MR. CHILDERS
That is distinctly my wish.

§ SIR JOHN PAKINGTON
said, he had no objection to accept the suggestion.

COLONEL JERVIS
said, he did not think the right hon. Baronet understood the subject. This £5,000 was part of £10,000 which should have been voted last year for the Engineers.

MR. PACK-BERESFORD
trusted that the Committee would not consent to withdraw this £5,000.

§ CAPTAIN ARCHDALL
complained of the consolidation of barrack districts, thereby imposing additional duties on barrack masters for which they were inadequately paid.