HC Deb 03 December 1867 vol 190 cc542-4
MR. HAYTER

asked the First Lord of the Admiralty, Whether he is aware that twenty of the destitute boys from the training ship Chichester, after having been duly passed and favourably reported upon by Sir Baldwin Walker, were struck off the books of the Formidable, because the certificates of their births could not be produced; and, whether the First Lord of the Admiralty will deem it right to remove this obstacle to the employment of such boys in the Royal Navy, and will communicate his decision to the Committee of the training ship Chichester?

MR. CORRY

Perhaps I may be allowed to say a few words in explanation of the circumstances to which the Question refers. By the 2nd clause of the Continuous Service Act, passed in 1853, it is provided that— Every boy entering when under the age of 18 years into the naval service shall be liable to serve until he attain the age of 23 years. But in order to make this entry binding it must be legal, and, as these boys are infants in the eye of the law, the entry is not legal unless it obtains the concurrence of the parent or guardian of the boy. In consequence of this, immediately after the passing of the Continuous Service Act, in 1853, an Admiralty circular was issued, which is to the following effect:— Boys must be over the age of 14½, and not above 16 years of age. They must have the written consent of parents or nearest relations, and must produce a certificate of birth from the registrar of the district in which they were born, or a declaration made by one of their parents before a magistrate of the day on which they were born. With reference to the necessity of this sanction to the entry of the boy I referred the question to the Solicitor of the Admiralty, Mr. Bristow, who says— The Act of 16 &c 17 Vict. c. 69, sec. 2, contemplates a legal entry by boys, and this can only be attained by their being entered with the consent of their parent or guardian. If this legal entry is not effected, the boy or man can take advantage of the flaw, and either leave the service at will or refuse to be bound by the Naval Discipline Act. Of course, a boy having no parent or guardian cannot be legally entered. Now, the cost of educating these boys is very considerable, and amounts, on an average, to £45 a year; so that in the case of a boy entering at 14½ years of age and remaining till 18 more than £150 would have been spent on his education, from which the country would derive little or no benefit if he then chose to leave the service. Perhaps the House may suppose that these claims to a discharge are of rare occurrence, but the contrary is the fact, and I am informed by my Colleague, Sir Sydney Dacres, that a great portion of his time is taken up with inquiries into applications by boys and their parents for discharge on account of alleged illegality of entry. These applications average, I am told, five per week. In addition to this reason against dispensing with the certificate of birth and the consent of the parent, there are other objections which I cannot better state than in the words of Captain Tremlett, Captain of the Impregnable, training ship at Devonport, and also Superintendent of the other training ships at Portsmouth, Portland, Devonport, and Falmouth. He says— Either a certificate of birth from the registrar of the district in which the candidate was born, or a declaration of age made by one of the parents before a magistrate, is absolutely requisite to determine the period at which the engagement from the age of eighteen is to commence; the frauds as to age are numerous and very vexatious; were this not very carefully attended to, large numbers would enter by misrepresentation, and, instead of getting strong, growing, and well-developed lads, we should be receiving dwarfs, who would in the end have to be discharged. As a rule, I have found that the development of lads from charitable institutions is very poor, and that they are greatly wanting in physique, and, further, that they do not grow. This I attribute to having in childhood been exposed to much privation, from which cause their system has received a shock which they rarely get over. Lastly, I beg to observe that we experience no difficulty in recruiting boys from the inland counties, from which we obtain a supply of fine, healthy, and strong country agriculturists; they soon become attached to the service, while the town boys, and especially those from London, are most restless, and endeavour to return to their old haunts. I can corroborate this statement from a personal inspection of the two training ships at Devonport in September last. We were much struck with the great superiority of the boys on board the Impregnable over those on board the Implacable—the other ship, and we ascertained that the cause of this difference was that the boys in one case came from the neighbouring counties, while in the other case they were received from the large towns of Plymouth, Stoke, and Devonport, and the immediate neighbourhood. I can, however, assure my hon. Friend that, although we prefer boys from the agricultural districts, those to whom his Question refers were not rejected because they came from the Chichester, but simply because they could not comply with the rules of the service by producing a certificate of birth and procuring the consent of their parents. Six, I think, were received because they were able to comply with these requisitions; and, under all the circumstances of the case, although my sympathies would be entirely in favour of these poor boys, I do not think it would be consistent with my duty to recommend a relaxation of the existing rules.