§ COLONEL WILSON PATTENsaid, he wished to ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department a Question in connection with the state of the manufacturing districts. The House was about to separate for the Easter holidays, and he thought it advisable that they should know from the right hon. Gentleman what he believed, from official information, to be the state of the cotton-manufacturing districts at the present moment. Several rumours had appeared in the papers, and statements had been made regarding disturbances in one or two places. He thought therefore that it was advisable they should have some assurance from the right hon. Gentleman that he was not alarmed by those statements, and that those districts were not likely to be seriously disturbed during the recess.
§ SIR GEORGE GREYIf my hon. Friend had asked this Question last night, I should have been able to answer him with greater confidence than I can now, from the-reports I have received, that the disgraceful disturbances which took place at Staleybridge had been completely suppressed, and that there was no apprehension of their being revived. I am sorry to say, however, that yesterday evening and this morning I received several letters from persons in a position to be correctly informed, expressing apprehensions that, owing to what they conceive to be the extremely injudicious conduct of the Mansion House Committee in sending a grant of £500 to Staleybridge on the first application made, under the circumstances at that time existing at Staleybridge, and without the slightest communication with the Central Committee at Manchester, there may be renewed attempts at disturbance. I do not feel alarmed in consequence of these letters, for I believe the measures that have been taken by the civil and military authorities—and much will depend upon the firmness of the civil authorities—will be sufficient effectually to suppress any attempt at a renewal of those outrages.
MR. ALDERMAN CUBITTI hope I may be allowed to say a word or two in vindication of the Mansion House Committee—
§ MR. SPEAKERsaid, that the hon. Member was out of order, there being no Question before the House. There 13 would be an opportunity for him to speak on the Motion for the adjournment of the House.
MR. ALDERMAN CUBITTI will, to put myself in order, move the adjournment of the House. Some few days ago, the Mansion House Committee received an application from three clergymen at Staleybridge, who had superintendence of adult schools, informing us that, in consequence of the sudden change in the administration of relief made by the Staleybridge Committee, they were sadly apprehensive that there would be disturbances, and they applied to us in some way or other to mediate with the Committee, so as to induce them to go back to the former system. Communication was had with the Staleybridge Committee, and we got letters from them, setting forth the reasons which induced them to adopt the change. Then came another letter, from the Incumbent of St. John's, Staleybridge, which I will read—
St. Paul's Parsonage, Staleybridge,March 21.Sir,—On behalf of the Rev. Messrs. Floyd and Bell, as well as myself, I beg to inform you, that the results we stated in our last as to be feared, if the respectful memorial we forwarded from the working men did not attain its object, have taken place. Every prudent person here was convinced, that if, in addition to other causes of complaint, the plan of giving tickets instead of money was rashly carried out, very unhappy consequences might be expected.The men unanimously refused the tickets. In the evening, we regret to say a crowd of lads and girls committed acts of violence, and the military were called out. The conduct of the men, we feel bound to state, was most excellent, though under circumstances of the most trying kind. Very few men took any part in the tumult.All this day the men have passed in quiet hope of some relief, but the Relief Committee have offered no compromise. Thus many hundreds of respectable, well-conducted men are left without food for to-day or to-morrow. This is a most sad fact, and full of danger. Extreme want will drive the most patient men to violence. We, therefore, again appeal for these sufferers to the Mansion House Committee, to which the working people have all along looked as a friend and protector. We beg of it to interpose before worse results take place.We have under our care schools containing respectively 115, 180, and 360 men. These have all behaved in a most proper manner, taking no part in the violence committed. But they all refuse the tickets. They are left destitute of relief. Many of them have not had a meal to-day. They have promised to assemble in their schools on Monday morning. We have promised to write for them to your Committee to beg most earnestly that some speedy succours may be extended to them. Extreme suffering will he endured, if this their cry for help to you he refused; and it is fearful to think of the results which may follow between a 14 starving people and the dragoons. Feeling deeply, we earnestly entreat your Committee, which has done so much good, to hasten to reach a helping hand to these poor and patient and law-abiding sufferers. We have asked them to wait patiently you reply. We beg of you to make a special grant to these and the other adult schools, for men in the town, for a week or two, so as to give time for things to be settled, and for the unwise proceedings which have been taken, to be reversed. An early and favourable answer may be in time to prevent tumult, and will certainly save many from undeserved and great suffering. Trusting the serious nature of the case will excuse our urgency, I remain yours, respectfully,W. WORTH HOARE,Incumbent of St. Paul's, Staleybridge.And for the Rev. T. Floyd, and W. Bell,Incumbents of Castle Hall and St. John's.That was on the 21st. On the 23rd a telegram was sent stating that the Mansion House Committee would be willing to receive any deputation they might be willing to send up. We then received the following letter:—St. Paul's Parsonage, Staleybridge,March 23,Sir,—Your welcome telegram arrived as Messrs. Floyd, Bell, and myself were speaking with men from many of the schools in the town. It gave them and us unspeakable relief, bringing tears to many eyes and 'Thank God!' from their lips. The hope given that your Committee will help them in this fearful crisis will gladden many a foodless home to-night. We verily believe you have not a moment too soon saved this town from bloodshed. Hitherto the rioters have been rough boys and girls. The men have been most praiseworthy in their conduct, and most surprisingly patient, when the fact is recollected that many most respectable and aged men have had to come without breakfast to school this morning, and have left their families in the same state at home. Some have come to ask leave to pawn clothing we had given them, to which, of course, we could but consent in the emergency. The amount necessary to pay all over sixteen at schools in the town for two weeks would be (as near as we can say), at 3s. per week,.£532 4s. As the attendance varies, and as two schools are shut up this week, we cannot speak precisely. Last week, it appears, the attendance was 1,744, and, as yet, the men have received nothing for that week. If your Committee could grant for the week ending last Friday, and that ending next Friday, time will be given to have these evils rectified, if possible. As the clergy and ministers of religion are not on the Staleybridge Relief Committee, we cannot answer for them, but we feel sure they would not distribute the money, as it is they who are madly forcing the tickets. I send a memorandum sent to every school to-day which seems conclusive on this point. The men who were present begged that the money might be sent to us three, and we will pay it to the various superintendents of schools and transmit vouchers to you at once The Rev. Thomas Floyd goes to town by to-night's express, and hopes to wait on your Committee at their meeting to-morrow, and answer any particulars you may desire to ascertain. By making this grant you 15 will have given a fresh occasion for gratitude to the people here, taken a load of suffering off them, and prevented the spread of angry feeling which must have lasted for long years to come, and probably prevented bloodshed—for dragoons parading the streets crowded with starving people can hardly be without great danger. Many thanks for your prompt attention to the cry of these sufferers.—Yours obediently,W. WORTH HOARE.We received the clergyman at the Mansion House, and deliberated on the subject for a couple of hours. The ultimate decision was not to send money down to the people, or to anybody but to the Relief Committee. We wrote and sent a letter to the Committee stating how much the Mansion House Committee deplored these unhappy occurrences, and suggesting that they should return to the system which they had hitherto carried on for a week or so, until they should have time to make such modifications as might seem desirable. We accompanied that letter with a cheque for £500 for the Committee to use as they might think fit. I have here in my hand a letter which I received this morning, and which will, I think, soothe the minds of hon. Gentlemen. It is from the Treasurer of the Relief Committee, to whom the £500 were sent. He says—Staleybridge Relief Fund, March 25,Sir,—I am duly in receipt of your letter of the 24th inst., enclosing cheque for £500, in which your Committee recommend that it he applied in the distribution of relief in money, instead of by ticket on shopkeepers as proposed by this Committee. My letters of the 23rd and 24th inst. would explain to you the reasons why this Committee proposed to adopt the ticket system; but as so much opposition has been brought against it, I beg to say that the Committee have reconsidered the matter, and it is expected that the question will be amicably and satisfactorily settled at a meeting to be held on Saturday next, when delegates representing the various schools will be appointed to confer with them on the subject. You are already aware that for the past and present weeks the men have agreed to accept payment by ticket, in which case this Committee propose to hold the cheque in hand, so that such modifications in the system of the distribution of relief may be introduced as may be deemed necessary and judicious.I am, Sir, your obedient servant,JAMES KIRK,J. Gibbs, Esq., Mansion House, London.Now, I hope the House will feel that we at the Mansion House were placed in a very distressing position. On the one hand, we were told riots were at the moment going on, and that bloodshed might be expected; on the other hand, we felt that to interfere with the action of the Committee was what we ought on no account to do. 16 Under these circumstances we thought we might mediate, and we wrote a conciliatory letter—a copy of which I have not now with me—suggesting that for the moment the local Committee should return to their original system, until they found whether they could apply modifications to the proposed change. We thought, that if we sent down a denial without any cheque for money, we should only have increased the violence of the agitation which prevailed; while, on the other hand, we felt very sensitively with regard to the position of those gentlemen in the locality who were devoting their best energies to the conduct of a great work. Then it was suggested that in sending a mediatory letter we had also better send the £500, not to go in addition to the relief, but to be applied in money.
§ COLONEL WILSON PATTENsaid, that no one in the House would be more unwilling than himself to deny the merit of what had been done by the hon. Member for Andover (Mr. Cubitt). He believed there was only one feeling in Lancashire in respect of the hon. Gentleman. The hon. Member was the first to suggest a subscription for the relief of the distress in the manufacturing districts; and whatever their opinions might be on other points, he (Colonel Wilson Patten) would venture to say there was not an individual in Lancashire who was not influenced by a feeling of gratitude to the hon. Gentleman. But he was obliged to accompany this with the expression of his deep regret at the conduct of the Committee at the Mansion House, over which the hon. Gentleman presided. There was in Lancashire a body of gentlemen who had devoted themselves for the last eight months, at the sacrifice of every other consideration, to relieve the distressed manufacturing districts. If the House could know the sacrifices which had been made by merchants and gentlemen in every class of society to attain that object, he was sure, that even though little errors might have been committed, the greatest consideration would be shown. One of the most embarrassing circumstances which the Central Relief Committee had had to meet was the state of the district about Staleybridge, Ashton, and Dukinfield. After mature consideration, and entirely in the interests of the working classes, they resolved to make certain alterations in the mode of relief. This, it appeared, had given dissatisfaction to some of the opera- 17 tives in the district. He had, however, such confidence in the good sense and good feeling of his constituents, that he was convinced, that it the parties had been left alone, they would have come to some satisfactory understanding. But just, at the wrong moment there came the unfortunate letter—for he must call it so—from the Mansion House Committee, which changed the whole aspect of affairs. He still trusted in the good sense of his constituents, that they would not be led away by certain ill-judged letters and by demagogues who were trying to make mischief. He had entire confidence in the good sense of the operative classes in Lancashire; and not withstanding the injudicious proceeding—for he could call it nothing else—of the Mansion House Committee, he believed they might look for a peaceful termination of this difficulty. He knew his hon. Friend (Mr. Cubitt) had but one feeling, and that was, a desire to relieve the distress of the operatives; but might he venture to suggest to him how totally impossible it, was efficiently to conduct a system of relief if there were two sources of distribution, and if, when for months the Central Committee had given the greatest consideration to the whole subject, it was, from time to time, to be superseded by individuals, who went to the Mansion House Committee and induced that Committee to counteract its proceedings. An attempt was being made to describe the Central Relief Committee and the manufacturers of Lancashire as being bent upon repressive measures in regard to the operatives in the county. Such was not the case; the Central Committee had a. very largo sum in hand for the purposes of relief, but the prospects were such that they were obliged to act economically. They did not know what the future might be, they had frequently been obliged to make their grants less than they wished; but it was done under an awful responsibility. They felt that they might have to provide for distress at a long distant period when they might not have funds to meet it with. Under these circumstances they took care to husband their resources so as to make the relief as permanent as possible. It happened that they did not always act in accordance with the feelings of the operatives; but it those operatives were not misled by parties who were actuated—he would not say by hadmotives—but by wrong impressions, he believed they would 18 see that the Central Committee was using every possible care in the distribution of the funds committed to their charge.
MR. ALDERMAN CUBITTwished to explain. He had been misunderstood. He begged to represent to the House that the London Committee was left to do the work for four months, during which time the other organization grew up—
§ MR. SPEAKERsaid, that the hon. Member might explain, but that he could not reply.
§ MR. FERRANDsaid, he wished to put a question to the right hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for the Home Department. He asked him, whether he was not aware that the English Factory Committee of Operatives stated that the body at large was not only opposed to the riotous proceedings of the last few days, but that they had expressed their strongest indignation and their deepest regret at their occurrence. He (Mr. Ferrand) had recently received large numbers of letters from operatives in Lancashire assuring him that no fear need be entertained of any further outbreak, and stating that they looked forward with the greatest interest to the discussion on the subject of the Lancashire distress that was to come off after Easter.
§ SIR GEORGE GREYsaid, the hon. Gentleman was quite right in staling that the great body of the operatives throughout Lancashire had taken no part whatever in the riotous proceedings and had given them no countenance. As he had already stated, the disgraceful disturbances were chiefly confined to Staleybridge; and when the excitement extended to other towns, it had been instigated chiefly by persons who had gone there from that place. He was glad to say that the conduct of the operatives as a body was beyond all praise. Nobody could doubt the benevolent intentions of the hon. Member for Andover (Mr. Cubitt), and he was sure the Mansion House Committee generally were actuated by the best motives. He fully agreed, however, with his hon. and gallant Friend opposite that it was to be regretted that there had been two sources of distribution of relief. As long as these two sources existed, had consequences would be likely to occur. He concurred with those Gentlemen who had the best means of information, and who had expressed their opinion that the conduct of the Mansion House Com- 19 mittee in regard to Staleybridge was, under existing circumstances, most injudicious. Their fault was not in sending the money, which the hon. Member for Andover appeared erroneously to suppose was the only alternative to a cold refusal, but in sending it without communicating with the Central Committee, which comprised men of great experience and local knowledge, and whose views should have been ascertained.
§ MR. BRIGHTI think it has been a misfortune from the beginning that there should have been two funds, one distributed from the Mansion House and the other from Manchester. There is one thing to be said for the Mansion House Committee. I think it not unlikely that the Lord Mayor, by opening a subscription list in London, has been able to get larger subscriptions than could otherwise have been obtained. But I do not think there is any man who has observed what has been doing in Lancashire during the last twelve months who will not agree with me in saying that it is a most unfortunate thing that there was ever more than one agency for the distribution of relief. I do not know how it is at Staleybridge, but I have heard that at Ashton the greatest difficulty has been experienced from this double organization. There has been a sort of competition between the two Committees by which the relief was given. I do not know whether the Mansion House Committee will take the course, but I should recommend them, if it be not too late, to let all the funds at their disposal go down to the Committee at Manchester. I can confirm what was said by the hon. Member for North Lancashire (Colonel Wilson Patten), that there are many men on that Committee who have given an amount of labour and time to this business of which those who are strangers in the district have little idea, who, I am sure, may be entirely trusted with the distribution of any funds which may be contributed from any part of the world on behalf of this great cause.
§ Motion made, and Question, "That this House do now adjourn," put, and negatived.