CASE OF THE REGIMENTAL SERGEANTS—QUESTION.

HC Deb 05 June 1857 vol 145 cc1248-50

On the Motion that the House resolve itself into a Committee of Supply,

SIR JOHN TRELAWNY?

asked "the Under Secretary for War whether the Minister for War has any intention of taking into his favourable consideration the case of certain Sergeants who appear to have been accidentally excluded from the intended benefits conferred upon non-commissioned officers by the Order of the 16th of January, 1857? His reasons for putting the question were these:—Before the warrant of January 16, 1857, and under the warrant of 1848, private soldiers, upon five years' service with good conduct, were entitled to one penny a day increase in their pay; and they were also entitled to another penny increase for every further five years up to fifteen years, when it amounted to 3d. per day additional. The man, however, who was made a sergeant lost that additional pay, and was only entitled to 1s. 10d. a day. On the 16th January of the present year a warrant was issued, giving good-conduct money to sergeants who had had it as privates, in addition to their pay. Now that was a grievance and a wrong to the older sergeants, who still received only 1s. 10d. per day, though their promotion for good conduct dated, it might be, some twenty years before. In fact, the private soldier of fifteen years' good conduct was paid nearly the same amount as those sergeants of twenty years' standing, though the latter had been in a highly-responsible position long previous to the former having entered the army. The question he desired an answer to did not emanate from the sergeants, though he had a number of their letters on the subject, all complaining of the false position in which they were placed, but from a gentleman thoroughly conversant with the intricate subject of Army Pay. He hoped, therefore, the Government would be prepared to redress the grievances of this respectable and highly useful body of men.

SIR WILLIAM RUSSELL

said, he was sure, from the tenor of the warrant, that the Secretary for War was anxious to do justice to the sergeants, but it had produced a most anomalous result. Men who, in consequence of their extreme good conduct, had been made sergeants before they had served five years, were not entitled to good-conduct pay, and although they might have been sergeants for upwards of fifteen years they had no additional pay for good conduct. He was aware of a case of a regimental sergeant-major who had been sixteen years a sergeant, but he was only entitled to 1d. a day good-conduct pay, which he obtained before his promotion, while other men who had only been sergeants for a year were entitled to 3d. a day for good conduct. The injustice might be remedied at a cost of less than £500 a year, which he thought Parliament would readily grant for such a purpose.

SIR JOHN RAMSDEN

said, that the hon. Baronet had only done justice to the intentions of the Secretary for War, when he said, that in issuing this circular his intention was to do justice to all parties. It was very difficult to frame a regulation which should meet all cases; but the Government were quite prepared to act up to the spirit of the memorandum, and to consider whether the instances mentioned by the hon. Baronet were really so anomalous as he considered them.

SIR WILLIAM CODRINGTON

said, he hoped that the ease of these sergeants would be favourably considered by the Government. It seemed very hard that a man who had been a long time a sergeant, I and must therefore have been a good-conduct man, should be placed at a disadvantage of 2d., 3d., or even 4d. a day compared with one recently promoted.

COLONEL NORTH

said, he would put the case of two men who joined the army at the same time, who were both made sergeants before they had served five years, and both continued as sergeants until they had been in the army ten years. Suppose one of them committed an offence for which be was tried by a court-martial and degraded to the rank of a private. Having served ten years he would be entitled to 2d. a day good-conduct money, but of this he would lose 1d. in consequence of the offence for which he had been reduced. If he conducted himself well during one year this penny would be restored to him, and if at the end of fifteen years' service he I again became a sergeant, he would have 3d. a day good-conduct money; so that, while the man who had never offended received but 1s. 10d. a day, he would have 2s. 1d. Such a case as that was evidently overlooked when the circular was framed; but he was sure that the hon. Baronet (Sir J. Ramsden) would now give it his best consideration.

SIR WILLIAM WILLIAMS

said, he felt convinced that to raise the moral condition of the army the most valuable agents were the sergeants. He was glad, therefore, to learn that the anomalies which existed in regard to them were to be removed.

LORD ADOLPHUS VANE-TEMPEST

said, he was glad also to hear that the case of the sergeants was to be attended to, and he hoped the injustice complained of would not be suffered to exist a moment longer than was necessary to find an effectual remedy for it. At present the anomaly pressed very hard upon a class of men, the want of whom would be a serious loss to the English army.

Motion agreed to.