HC Deb 23 March 1847 vol 91 cc332-4
MR. LABOUCHERE

moved for leave to bring in a Bill to amend and continue an Act of the last Session of Parliament for making provision, until the 1st day of September, 1847, for the treatment of poor persons afflicted with fever in Ireland. The right hon. Gentleman said, that the Act referred to in the Motion, was introduced by the right hon. Gentleman the late Secretary for the Home Department; and although it contained some valuable provisions, yet Her Majesty's Government, and especially the Irish Government, were of opinion that in the present condition of Ireland, and with the prospect which, he feared, there was before them of a great deal of fever in that country, not only would it be right to continue it, but to make some considerable alterations in it. The principal alterations proposed to be made were, first, to transfer to the relief committees appointed under the Bill now going through that House, the powers hitherto intrusted to the boards of guardians. It had been found by experience that it was necessary to have a more summary mode of proceeding than was applicable with the machinery of the poor law. It required some time to levy the poor rate and to force on the boards of guardians, who might be reluctant to carry that or other Bills into effect, the operation of any particular law; but the machinery of the relief committees was more extensive, and had this advantage over that of the poor-law guardians, that these committees were distributed far more generally throughout the country, and were able to deal with their particular localities in a more immediate manner than the poor-law guardians. Another alteration proposed was, that the expense should be thrown entirely upon the general fund. The object be had in view was paramount to every consideration of money, namely, to prevent the spread of disease and pestilence in Ireland, which, under the circumstances, he thought there was but too much reason to apprehend. It would, however, be better to postpone any discussion upon the subject until the Bill was in the hands of hon. Members.

SIR J. GRAHAM

did not rise for the purpose of creating any discussion; but he wished to ask the right hon. Gentleman a question with respect to the statement he had just made, and which he (Sir J. Graham) had not clearly comprehended. The charge of this measure, as the Act now stood, was devolved on the poor rates exclusively, and was borne, therefore, entirely by the local funds, except the salaries of the public officers. He had understood the right hon. Gentleman to state, that it was his intention, by the Bill he was about to introduce, to change, not only the man- agement, and to transfer it from the poor-law guardians to the relief committees, but also to make some change with reference to the funds out of which this expense was to be borne, and to throw it from the poor rates on to the general relief fund. In the first instance, it would no longer be borne by the local rates, but by that part of the public money which contributed to those relief committees; and, in the next place, if he understood rightly, one moiety of that would be thrown on the public funds altogether, whilst the other moiety only would be thrown on the local funds. That was a most important change. It was a transfer to the taxpayers of this country of a moiety of the entire charge, which, as the matter now stood, was borne by the local funds.

MR. LABOUCHERE

said, the right hon. Gentleman had stated correctly the change that was proposed to be made by this Bill. All he would say, then, was this—that it was justifiable to throw on the general relief fund the expenses of this measure, rather than on the poor rates. He could not conceive any charge more important than that of providing the funds for enabling them to check fever amongst the people of Ireland, which he feared was too certain, in consequence of the great destitution from which they had suffered.

MR. SHAW

supposed the measure was not to be permanent—if intended only as a temporary one, he would not object to it.

MR. LABOUCHERE

said, it was only a provision of a temporary character, until the 1st of September, 1847, and thence until the end of the next Session of Parliament.

MR. HUME

said, that ever since he had been in that House, fever had existed in Ireland to a very great extent, and the expense had always been borne by the rates of that country. If they admitted the principle of this measure, he knew of no charge that might not be thrown upon this country. They ought to have more explanation about it; and he would, therefore, propose, that the matter should be postponed until there was an opportunity of discussing it.

Leave given.