HC Deb 05 August 1839 vol 49 cc1270-1

On the proposal to grant 8,928l. for defraying the expenses of Maynooth,

Colonel Percival

regretted that Government had not given the Irish Members an opportunity of expressing an opinion on this vote, by bringing forward the estimates at an earlier period, and he believed that the delay was purposely made; but at that late period of the Session it was useless to take a division against the vote, although if his friends chose to divide they should have his vote.


Cole would certainly divide the House upon the question.

Mr. Redington

said, that the reason why the inquiry into this grant was not brought forward at an earlier period, did not rest with hon. Members on that (the Ministerial) side of the House; but a want of determination on the part of hon. Members opposite, one of whom, the noble Lord, the Member for Durham, having had a notice on the book for a long time.

Viscount Castlereagh

believed that the opposition to this vote was daily increasing and he could no longer be a silent instru- ment in supporting a vote which went to oppose the Established Church.

Viscount Morpeth

said that as this was an annual skirmish be would not prolong the discussion, but he must say that his only objection to the vote was that it was too scanty. He did not deny that, after they had left Maynooth, the Catholic clergy, like every other class of religious teachers, did take part in politics, but politics did not form part of the system of instruction; on the contrary, he believed that they were carefully kept out of the system.

Mr. Finch

would regret to sec the day when the House should refuse to come to a vote for the support of the education of the Catholic clergy. As a Dissenter he was sure he spoke the language of Dissenters, when he said that they were quite willing to accord to Catholics the right of worshipping their Maker after their own mode, and after their own creed, and if they did this it was but right to grant to a large majority of the Irish nation the means of educating their clergy. If the vote should come forward in another Session he trusted it would be recollected that a portion of the money of all classes, as well in England as in Ireland, was appropriated to professors in the English Universities, whilst a great part of the people of this country was shut out from those Universities by the test established by them.

The House divided: Ayes 53; Noes 9: Majority 44.

List of the AYES.
Adam, Admiral Labouchere, rt. hn. H.
Aglionby, H. A. Lushington, C.
Attwood, T. Lushington, rt. hn. S.
Baring, F. T. Maule, hon. F.
Barnard, E. G. Morpeth, Viscount
Barry, G. S. Muskett, G. A.
Blake, W. J. Norreys, Sir D. J.
Bridgeman, H. O'Connell, M. J.
Brotherton, J. Pigot, D. R.
Callaghan, D. Redington, T. N.
Donkin, Sir R. S. Russell, Lord J.
Elliot, hon. J. E. Rutherford, rt. hn. A.
Finch, F. Scholefield, J.
Grattan, J. Smith, J. A.
Grey, rt. hon. Sir G. Smith, B.
Hawes, B. Somerville, Sir W. M.
Hector, C. J. Stanley, hon. E. J.
Hodges, T. L. Stanley, hon. W. O.
Hoskins, K. Steuart, R.
Howard, P. H. Stock, Dr.
Howick, Visct. Surrey, Earl of
Hume, J. Troubridge, Sir E. T.
Hutton, R, Vigors, N. A.
Wallace, R. Wyse, T.
Warburton, H. Yates, J. A.
Wilde, Mr. Serjeant TELLERS.
Williams, W. O'Ferrall, M.
Wood, C. Gordon, R.
List of the NOES.
Blair, J. Lockhart, A. M.
Burroughes, H. N. Palmer, G.
Castlereagh, Visct. Perceval, Colonel
Freshfield, J. W. TELLERS.
Grimsditch, T. Cole, Viscount
Hodgson, R. Round, J.

The House resumed. The Chairman reported the resolutions of the House, and obtained leave to sit again.