§ The Attorney-Generalsaid, there could be no doubt that the resolution having omitted, to provide for the case of a Division in Committee, such a Division could not be come to unless the House were prepared to make the necessary alteration in the wording of the resolution.
§ Mr. WardUndoubtedly the intention of the Committee, from which the resolutions emanated, had been, that the plan should apply to all the Divisions of the House, and he would, therefore, with the permission of the House, move that the word "Chairman" be inserted in the resolution in order to avoid the difficulty. He then moved his amendment, but was reminded that he had given no notice. The hon. Member appealed to the Speaker whether he was to give notice or not?
§ The Speakersaid, that the usual course certainly was to give notice of any motion intended to be brought forward.
§ Mr. Humesubmitted that there were cases, however, in which the House was called upon to wave the standing regulations, and that this was one of those in which it could come to an immediate decision.
§ The Speakersaid, there was no doubt if a Member was in possession of the House, he might make any motion he thought fit, but at the same time it had been customary far many years past for hon. Members to give notice of the motions they intended to make. It was a question whether a 1155 motion, which was to alter a resolution of the House, could be immediately made, and without notice.
§ Mr. Groteobserved, that the resolutions rendered it imperative that the order for closing the doors should be given by Mr. Speaker, and if that person were not there to perform that duty, no Division could take place in the Committee. He thought it was the duty of the House at once to adopt some means by which the difficulty could be removed.
§ Mr. Wardsaid, that it was perfectly clear, that the business of the Committee could not be proceeded with until that difficulty was disposed of, and all he desired was, to make such an alteration in the wording of the resolution as would enable them to go on with the measure now under consideration. He therefore proposed to move, that all the provisions for divisions contained in the third resolution should be applied by order of the Chairman of a Committee as well as by the Speaker.
Mr. Heathcotesaid, that he could not approve of the proposition of the hon. Member for St. Alban's, because it might lead to serious injury if they were to allow any alteration of their proceedings to be made without notice on this subject having been previously given. It would, in fact, be establishing a principle which he hoped the House would never sanction.
§ Mr. Robert Steuartconsidered, that the hon. Gentleman in the chair had certainly the power to control the Committee, and if he had expressed his opinion on the subject, the difficulty would not have arisen. He understood that the motion that the Chairman should report progress was made, that the House might have the opinion of the Speaker as to whether the Committee should divide in the House or under the new system. He conceived it to be much more desirable that the House should have the opinion of the Chair on this point, than that they should continue to waste their time in discussion,
§ Mr. Warburtonsaid, that the third resolution provided that the Speaker should give orders for the doors to be closed. He apprehended that it would be quite competent for the Speaker, although he were not in the chair, to allow the Division to be taken in the manner expressed in this resolution.
§ The Speakerwas very unwilling to interfere, unless distinctly appealed to, but 1156 on an occasion of this kind he should not discharge his duty if he did not deliver his opinion. He was not surprised at the difficulty in which the House was now involved, because it had always appeared to him that some doubt might arise from the manner in which the resolutions were worded, though a word or two more would have removed it. He conceived that the question for the House now to decide was, whether they were of opinion that the words, "the doors being simultaneously opened by the Speaker's order," when put in competition with the other parts of the resolution, did not justify the House in coming to the decision that the resolution as it now stood did distinctly require, that the Committee should divide in the same form and manner as had been up to that time in use. He apprehended that there could be no difficulty in the House dividing on this occasion in the usual way. If the House were of opinion that for the future it would be expedient to establish the proposition moved by the hon. Member for St. Alban's, it would be only on the present occasion that the existing mode would be adopted.