HC Deb 08 November 1830 vol 1 cc299-315
Mr. Herries

moved the Order of the Day for the House to resolve itself into a Committee on the Act regulating the Intercourse between the West-Indian Islands and the United States of America, and the House having resolved itself into a Committee, he went on to say, that his object was, to make some changes in the Act regulating the commercial intercourse between the West-Indian possessions of this country, and the United States, with a view to establish a permanent system applicable to that part of our trade. The Act he proposed to amend was that passed in the year 1825, under the auspices of the late Mr. Huskisson; and his Amendments would relate to the schedule of protecting duties on the productions of our own country, and our own colonies, in exchange with each other, as compared with the imports into those colonies from foreign States. An event of considerable importance to the empire at large, and unquestionably to certain parts of our colonial possessions, had recently occurred, to which it was indispensably necessary that he should advert, in order to explain to the Committee the views under which he proposed the change in the schedule to which he had adverted; that event was the final conclusion of the point, long contested between Great Britain and the United States, as to the degree and manner in which the latter were to prosecute their intercourse with the West Indies. He had the gratification of being able to state, that a topic of discussion between two nations which had occupied the longest time, and was of the most intricate character of any within memory, and which had been subject to many variations of pretension on both sides, had now been amicably, and, he trusted, for ever, terminated to the satisfaction of both parties. Further, he had to inform the Committee that the adjustment had taken place on the basis, and without the slightest departure from that basis, of the Act of 1825, which laid down definitively the principles on which Great Britain would allow to foreigners a participation in the trade of her West-Indian possessions. It was well known to all, that the dispute upon this point had been carried on almost from the date when the United States ceased to be a component part of the British empire. The views of their Government on this subject, in the first instance, were very limited, and they were then willing to accept, as a sort of boon, what they had since claimed as a right; the British Government was then, and had ever since been willing to admit the claim upon any reasonable grounds; but various causes, from time to time, arose to impede the conclusion of the question by amicable convention. From 1794 the proposals of the British Government were continually rejected by the United States, and up to 1810 it was found impossible to effect any arrangement. During the war which subsequently ensued, a positive interdiction existed until 1815, excepting in cases when the governors of colonies were empowered, from time to time, to open the ports of the islands to the shipping of the United States. On the conclusion of peace this country reverted to her original principle of the exclusive possession of the trade of her own colonies. From that date until the present, scarcely a single year had passed without an in-fructuous attempt on the one side or on the other to settle the question. By what was known by the name of Mr. Robinson's Act a fair opening seemed offered for the arrangement of the commercial intercourse between the United States and the British Colonies; but the measures adopted in consequence by the republic were certainly not such as to render the Statute effective for the purpose for which it was passed. Since that date, the claims advanced by the United States in 1824, had been entirely retracted, or it was obvious that it would have been impossible to have fully and completely arranged the matter in dispute. They had unconditionally withdrawn their unfounded pretensions, and this country now stood on the footing it occupied in 1825, and which it announced to all the world it was determined to maintain. He was bound to add, and he should not do justice to the United States if he did not, that it was impossible for any government to conduct a negotiation, in which the most important interests of two countries were deeply concerned, in a more frank, straight-forward, conciliatory, and therefore, as he thought, politic, wise, and prudent manner, than the United States had conducted this negotiation throughout. He believed that on this occasion neither party had had the slightest reason to complain of the other, but both had just grounds of satisfaction and mutual confidence. Certain documents connected with this important question had already been laid upon the Table of Parliament, and others, to complete the series, would, of course, in due time be communicated. It was fit to state, in order that no undue impression might be made upon the mind of any individual, that in concluding this last and final arrangement, the present ministers had adhered, without exception, to the principles laid down by their predecessors in office, as expressed in those documents. The American government had not only abandoned its former principles, but had also satisfied the British Government, by producing the enactment under which the revocation of those principles was to take effect; and lest any ambiguity should arise, the most distinct explanations had been required on the one side, and given on the other. This country was thus called upon, by every consideration, to admit the United States to a participation in that trade from which they had hitherto been excluded. The law of 1825 was framed with a view that all nations should participate in it; and it was only the conduct of the United States which had hitherto prevented them from enjoying the benefits which others had reaped from participation. It must be satisfactory to the House to learn that all those matters in difference were now finally and completely set at rest; but it was, at the same time, indispensably necessary to consider what changes had occurred since the enactment of the schedule of duties—whether anything had occurred since 1826 to render those duties unfit for the purpose for which they were intended; viz. the due protection of our own colonial interests. The effect of the existence of non-intercourse between the West Indies and the United States had been, to create new channels of trade, and to raise up a new class of claimants to the protection afforded by duties; it had produced a circuitous intercourse by means of our own North-American colonies; and whatever might have been the intention of this country in 1825, it was necessary now to tell the United States, that as they were the cause of the change, they must abide by the consequences. The Act of 1825 contained the conditions of equality on which the trade was to be carried on, and it also contained the schedule of protecting duties; but all parties were at all times given to understand that the British Government reserved to itself the right of altering those duties without responsibility to any foreign State. To avoid the possibility of mistake, the claim to exercise this right had been especially impressed upon the government of the United States; no objection could, therefore, be raised by any party to the course he now wished to pursue, and, least of all, by that government which, from time to time, had changed its tariff just as suited its temporary views. He meant, therefore, to propose some not immaterial alterations in the schedule of duties, the chief object of which would be, to secure the interests of the British North-American colonies from suffering in consequence of the confidence with which they had embarked in specu- lations, and made investments, under the belief that the present system was likely to be of longer continuance. Whether our colonists could claim this protection as a strict right was a different question, but there was no doubt that Parliament ought to feel an earnest solicitude for their interests. One object of the schedule of 1825 was, to encourage the introduction into the West Indies of articles from our North-American colonies: it had succeeded, but, under the change of circumstances, it was now the business of this country to take off part of the duty on foreign shipping, which, to the present moment, had existed, and had operated against the United States. The circuitous trade through our North-American colonies had been encouraged by this Government, and such, as he had already remarked, was the design of the schedule. It was true, that the lower descriptions of grain and flour had never yet passed through those colonies: they had been derived from the United States; but lumber of every description, wood and staves—of the greatest importance to the West Indies —had been conveyed thither entirely from our North - American colonies. The schedule would, therefore, give increased protection to the Canadas for the carriage of those articles, and a protecting duty would be imposed for the maintenance of their interests: that duty would be merely an increase of the impost upon lumber; it was already 7s. per thousand staves, and he should propose that it be raised to 10s. 6d. per thousand. The planters would thus be furnished at as cheap a rate as they could reasonably expect, and the principle of the change would be, to afford that degree of protection which would balance the foreign supply, so as to give to the consumer as fair a competition as possible. The better mode would be, that he should lay before the House, in a printed form, a comparison between the two schedules, so that the House would at once perceive how the law stood now, and how he proposed that it should stand in future. That comparison was probably by this time printed; and the House would be aware that, in consequence of the distance, it was fit that no delay should occur, and that the new duties should come into operation at the date of the Order in Council which had already been issued. He could not refrain from observing, that these changes must oper- ate considerably to the advantage of this country: he did not know that they would operate to the disadvantage of the United States, and he doubted if any country permanently gained by the commercial injury of another State. It seemed to him that much would be gained on both sides—to the shipping interests at home, as well as to our North-American possessions. It was to him a matter of the highest satisfaction to mark the growing prosperity of those colonies; among other recent benefits, they were drawing coal in some parts of Canada, of a quality of peculiar excellence, which they were longing to be able to export to the United States. A system of free intercourse must always be preferable to restriction, and the system he was about to recommend was far more beneficial than that which had so long existed. Was such a state, was the entire suspension of the intercourse between our West-Indian colonies and the United States, to be compared to that which he now had the satisfaction to see established. There was an important feature by which that schedule was distinguished from all former ones. It was this—that, in whatever territory the commodities introduced from our West-Indian islands into the United States may have been produced, they were to be admitted without any additional duty. The hon. Gentleman then referred to the comparative tables for the proof of the advantageous terms under which the produce of our West-Indian colonies will henceforth be received in the United States, and concluded by moving, that it was the opinion of that committee, that, "no duties be imposed on commodities, introduced into his Majesty's Colonies in the West Indies, from the United States of America other than those described in the schedule."

Mr. George Robinson

would not trouble the Committee with any remark on the schedule proposed for the sanction of the Committee by the right hon. Gentleman opposite. But with respect to the hon. Gentleman's assertion, that all parties interested in the commercial prosperity of England, would receive with satisfaction the announcement of the new footing on which the intercourse of our colonies in the West Indies with the United States of America has been placed, he (Mr. R.) could not help observing, that there was one party deeply interested in the question, which would hear with great regret the change which the British Government had thought proper to make in that intercourse. He acknowledged that this was done in strict accordance with the policy of a statesman, whose loss he (Mr. R.) deplored as much as any man—but he would ask the right hon. Gentleman, if there had not been a decided change in the commercial policy of the United States of America, since the measures introduced by Mr. Huskisson in the year 1825? He asked if it had not been the policy of those States, according to the tariff since enacted, to exclude from their territory every article of British production? He would ask if this were the time to make a change in our commercial policy in favour of the United States, when, by the Tariff of 1828, our productions were virtually shut out from their territories? He insisted that it had always been the object of the United States to obtain that uninterrupted access to our colonies in the West Indies which Ministers had now conceded, without any adequate compensation. In his view the effects of the present measures would be, to throw the whole trade with the West-India islands into the hands of the United States, to the exclusion of our North-American colonies. By those measures the whole business of the shipping at present employed in the carrying trade between the Canadas and the British possessions in the West Indies, would be transferred to the commercial navy of the United States. But the right hon. Gentleman had told them that they had now-made concessions which they refused in 1828. Those concessions, however, seemed to consist in their return to the duties existing before that time. When, by their refusal of the terms of reciprocity offered them, they found that their own commerce was injured, they strove to compensate their losses by the imposition of additional duties on British colonial produce. He remembered well, that the right hon. Gentleman formerly said, that the consequence of the American government persisting in that hostile policy might be, that we should be compelled to lay an impost on American raw produce introduced into this country; and the only question with the hon. Gentleman then was, whether we could impose such a duty consistently with our own interests? He recollected that in the correspondence between Mr. Canning and the minister of the United States (Mr. Galatin) that the former asserted, that, in consequence of the policy pursued by that government respecting the intercourse of the United States with our colonies in the West Indies, any alteration in duties to which American produce should be subjected, upon its importation into those colonies, must be effected by an Act of the British Legislature, and could not be effected by any treaty or convention. He (Mr. R.) insisted, that our colonies in North America had a right to complain that they were taken by surprise, when measures affecting their commercial interests so deeply were adopted suddenly, and without giving them any notice to prepare themselves for the change. At the time of the Treaty of Ghent, the merchants and other persons interested, were made acquainted before-hand with the changes which it was proposed to effect in the commercial relations of the States who were parties to that treaty. He would ask, why were British subjects in North America not considered entitled to a similar notice of changes seriously affecting their commercial interests? He gave the right hon. Gentleman credit for his not having disguised this important result of the proposed measure—namely, that the commercial interests of British subjects would suffer by it, and especially the shipping interest. He knew that it had been the policy of the government of the United States, in its anxiety to obtain for its commercial navy the advantages which it must derive from an extension of the intercourse between those States and our West-India colonies, to represent that both parties would gain by the extended intercourse. He never believed it. In consequence of the proximity of the West Indies to the coasts of the United States, every change in the West-Indian markets is known in the commercial towns of those States a month before the information can reach our North-American Colonies. In that way the Americans of the United States would have overwhelming advantages in the competition with the Canadian merchants. This measure, therefore, would go to destroy an important branch of our shipping interest, which had grown up within the last twenty years in New Britain, Nova Scotia, and the Canadas. The registered tonnage of the British West-India Islands, and of our North-American Colonies, had in one year in- creased by nearly 60,000 tons. The carriage heretofore had been exclusively by British ships, and that to the amount of one million tons, the greater part of which must, in the competition with the United States, to which the proposed measure would give rise, be transferred from the hands of our colonial merchants. In the course of a few years all the vessels engaged in the carrying trade between our North-American Colonies and the West-India islands must be laid up. That branch of the shipping interest, which hitherto had not suffered the same depression as the other branches of the British commercial navy, would be reduced to a condition of which it did not require the gift of prophecy to predict the results. Much stress had often of late years been laid, by hon. Gentlemen opposite, upon the improvements that had taken place in the Canadas. Immense sums of money had been granted by that. House to push the prosperity of those colonies still further; canals had been constructed in them at a vast expense to this country; British subjects had been encouraged to transfer large capitals from the United Kingdom to the colonies, by official descriptions of their prosperity. He would ask, then, if the British capital now invested in machinery, in shipping, and in the agricultural improvement of the Canadas, were to be totally sacrificed? He was sure, that the moment the news of the measure now announced should reach those colonies, all speculation would be suspended, and instead of affording an asylum to the superabundant part of our population, the distresses resulting from the measures would necessarily aggravate the distresses of the empire at large. When the consideration of the question was pressed on the Government, in the time of Mr. Canning and Lord Dudley, it was declared that they would not consent to entertain it, unless the Americans should revise the Tariff of 1826. It could not, therefore, be said that we were now making the commercial changes in accordance with the views of the two statesmen (Mr. Canning and Mr. Huskisson), alluded to by the right hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Herries), unless the American government had altered their whole commercial policy since the time of those statesmen. Would Mr. Canning or Mr. Huskisson consent to such changes, after the hostility which the American government had manifested to our interests? At the very moment when we were making such concessions in favour of the United States, they were acting on decidedly an opposite principle. Their whole scale of duties was one of prohibition, as regards the importation of British colonial produce. They had shown no disposition to concur in the liberal arrangements of this Government. He had some interest in the West-India islands; but he could not see that they would be benefitted by those changes which must, at all events, operate injuriously upon the North-American colonies. The United States could supply those islands with every article with which they were at present supplied by Great Britain, and by the Canadas; and thus that trade would be sacrificed, which it was the most desirable to maintain—the trade which consists in an interchange of superfluities between one part of the empire and another. He felt satisfied that the West Indies, in supplying America with rum and sugar, must lose entirely the trade they at present enjoy with our possessions in North America, and a great part of their trade with the mother country. In all our negotiations with the United States, the latter have had the advantage. He did not mean to say, that our Ministers were less talented as diplomatists than those of America, but they had exhibited less knowledge of the relative commercial interests of the two countries. The whole policy of the United States towards us had been one of restriction and prohibitions, while our policy had been, to open our trade to them, first that with our American colonies, then that with the United Kingdom, and lastly, that with the West Indies. He was willing to hope, that the present measure might prove as advantageous as was anticipated by the right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Herries), but he feared that not only would our shipping-interest be injuriously affected by it, even the West-Indian interests, which it was proposed to benefit, would suffer from it a considerable loss. The changes, if made at all, ought at least to be gradual; for sudden transition must bring on extensive and irretrievable ruin. The right hon. Gentleman had said, that as soon as the House should ratify the schedule then laid before it, the ports of America would, according to the President's Message, be thrown open to the introduction of our colonial produce, and he had urged that we should not delay to fulfil the required condition, as, in the mean time, we are continually losing by the imposition of the old duties. He believed, however, that we should be much greater losers by the exclusion of British colonial commodities from the West Indies, which must be immediately occasioned by the influx of American produce, which would be poured into those islands, under advantages with which our merchants could not compete. He hoped that Government would allow time for those whose interests would be affected by the change, to prepare themselves for the result. The changes which had heretofore been made in the commercial policy of this country had been introduced so suddenly as to involve in ruin all those who were concerned with the branches of trade affected by the alterations. The policy of Mr. Canning was very different, as shewn in his correspondence with Mr. Galatin, from that now recommended to the House. Mr. Canning had declared, that whatever change should be made in the intercourse between the United States and the West Indies, should be effected by an Act of the Legislature, and not by negotiation between the two governments. That statesman had always denied the right of every foreign government to make our internal and municipal regulations the object of its stipulations. Contrary to that declaration, the House was then called on to confirm a treaty, which Government had already ratified with the United States, to alter our colonial regulations. The House was only consulted as to the rate of duty; the Government had already decided upon the principle. He concluded by assuring the House, that in the statements which he had made he had not been influenced by prejudice: and that he should be glad to be corrected, if he were mistaken in his views.

Mr. Keith Douglas

considered, that every regulation tending to extend the intercourse between the two nations, Great Britain and the United States, must give mutual confidence to the merchants of both. Gentlemen must be aware, that in this attempt to protect the peculiar interests of our North-American colonies, that protection must be purchased at the expense of other parts of the British empire. In consequence of the distressed condition of the West-Indian interest for some time past, the Board of Trade had investigated fully all the burthens borne by these colonies, and had inquired into the causes of their distress. The result of that inquiry had been, that no countervailing duties could be imposed for their relief; and the House was, therefore, called on to lighten the burthen to which they were subjected for the benefit of other parts of the empire.

Mr. Herries

thought, that he had explained already that the West-Indian colonies would continue to receive without duty what they now received without paying a duty. The condition of the West-Indies must, at all events, be improved; and he did not conceive that the improvement would be effected at the expense of the North-American colonies. He could not agree with the hon. Gentleman opposite in his interpretation of the language of Mr. Canning. Having entered into treaties with the Spanish settlements in America, and with other countries, and when we found that the United States of America (the only country which was excluded from participation in the commerce with our colonies) were coming round, it did seem advisable to admit the United States to that trade on the same conditions on which it was enjoyed by other nations. The only question then to be considered was, whether the duties described in the schedule submitted to the House were sufficient for the protection of our colonial interests. If they were sufficient, the argument of the hon. Gentleman opposite fell to the ground. The principle on which they were founded was that of protection. The hon. member for Middlesex had said, that the proposed duties were too high; so that the whole question was now only one of degree.

Mr. Keith Douglas

did not wish to enter then into details, but he objected, for one thing, to the increase of duty on shingles.

Mr. Hume

said, that the Ministers had on the present occasion furnished an example of the folly of bringing forward a plan for the purpose of pleasing every body. They had succeeded in pleasing nobody. The West-Indians were dissatisfied, and the North-Americans were dissatisfied, and he was dissatisfied. The Government professed to act on the principle of free-trade; but the principle acted upon, in the practice, seemed to him to be that of making the colonies pay as dearly as possible for what they consumed. When a similar measure to that now before the House was brought forward in 1825, he resisted it. He deprecated the plan of inducing people to believe at any time, that Government would persevere in upholding such monopolies as that hitherto possessed by the Canadas in the trade with our West-Indian colonies. He deprecated the policy by which the several parts of the empire were considered as having not one common interest, but distinct and even conflicting interests. He would contend most strenuously against the principle of the arrangements which it was the object of the present Motion to carry into effect. He did most sincerely hope, that his Majesty's Government would see the necessity of laying open the whole of the trade. For his part he could not let any opportunity pass of entering his protest against the monopoly of the West Indies; and as to what the right hon. Gentleman had said respecting the improved disposition of the present American government to treat with us, he saw no reason to complain of the conduct of former governments; at least, he saw no grounds for the assertion that the present government of America was at all more disposed to treat than any of its predecessors. He could not help expressing his surprise that any one could suppose that it would be beneficial to this country to adopt the American Tariff; at the same time it was to be observed, that the American duties did not amount to 100 per cent, while, if such a statement could be made, the duty imposed by the Government of Great Britain amounted in some cases, to 1,200 per cent; on tobacco, as the House knew, there was a duty to that extent imposed. Was there any hope that the Government and the Legislature would at any time arrive at the conclusion that we ought to have every foreign commodity at the lowest possible rate? Convinced as he was of that important truth, he could not but deprecate anything in the nature of retaliation; and he, therefore, with the deepest regret, heard the late lamented Mr. Huskisson, contrary to his usual practice, and in direct opposition to those principles which he attained his highest distinction by advocating, say that circumstances might arise in which it would be for the interest and advantage of this country to retaliate on foreign countries by imposing heavy duties on their productions. Those duties were neither more nor less than bounties; and surely no inconsistency could be more gross than the advocacy of free-trade, and the maintenance of bounties. It was well understood that the effect of those duties was, to prevent intercourse between the United States and our West-India colonies; that object was to be effected by protecting duties. Now to every sort of protecting duty he was opposed. If any duty were required for the purpose of revenue, let it be imposed; but let no duty be laid on for the purpose of protection, or in any respect for the purpose of acting as a bounty, and, least of all, for the purposes of maintaining a monopoly. The time had arrived when all monopoly should cease, but he saw with regret that his Majesty's Government was not impressed with the truth and importance of that principle. The measure before the House was neither one thing nor another; it was at best robbing Peter to pay Paul, taking from the West-Indies to give to Canada, while the abolition of monopoly would equally benefit all parts of the empire.

Mr. Charles Grant

observed, that the subject before the House involved two questions—the first was, the great principle upon which the measure rested; the second was, what might be called its details, or rather the means by which the object in view was to be carried into effect. To the latter of these divisions he would not address himself; as to the former he had to observe, that in any discussion respecting it, he wished to look upon it as a great national and imperial question, not having for its object to benefit or injure any particular class, neither in our North-American nor our West-India colonies. They were not, as he conceived, then to enter upon a discussion of the principle established by the Act of 1822, and recognized by that of 1825 —recognized upon an enlarged basis. Against the re-opening of any such question, he begged most distinctly to enter his protest. It was not to be made a question then, or at any time, whether or not their colonies were to be preserved in a flourishing condition, or whether means were to be taken by the Government of Great Britain for preserving relations of peace and amity with a great commercial country, allied to us by birth, and that ought ever to be united by the remembrance of a kindred origin; it was not to be then made a question whether we ought or ought not to cultivate friendly intercourse with a great nation, that was expanding itself over the vast continent of America; it was not to be mooted whether the laws of God or of nature could make us the natural enemies of such a people. There was no regulation favourable to commerce that we could make, which was not as essential to our own welfare as it could be to the welfare of the United States. The hon. member for Middlesex had spoken of the difficulties attendant upon negotiations; but as he (Mr. Grant) trusted that the present measure would close the chapter of negotiation upon this subject, he should be most unwilling to call upon the Government to retrace its steps, or renew discussions which he considered as so happily closed. The objects of the United States, as he apprehended them, had been most incorrectly stated in the course of that discussion; their demand was nothing less than requiring freedom to trade with our colonies upon the same terms as the mother country traded with those colonies. On three or four separate occasions the principle was avowed and acted on, both in 1822 and 1823. The object appeared to be, to induce us to abandon the advantages which we derived from the possession of colonies. It was not, however, to be endured, that any country should attempt to compel this to adopt any particular code of commerce, or to dictate to us the manner in which we were to deal with our own municipal regulations; but the period had at length arrived when the negotiation was to be closed, and it would be for the honour and interest of this country neither to suffer its dignity to be offended with impunity on the one hand, nor, upon the other, to cherish any acrimonious or vindictive feeling. He certainly regretted that any such feeling had existed between the two countries, and he was proportionally glad that a better feeling was growing up, and the restrictive system connected with it was in a fair way to be abolished. It was due to the Government of the country, however, to say, that it never opposed removing those restrictions, but it wisely refused to pledge itself, on the supposition that the American legislature might repent its noxious and peculiar restrictions. He regretted, certainly, that, in the execution of a measure justified by sound principles, and necessary to the West-India islands, any other part of his Majesty's dominions should suffer. He felt for the situation of the Canadians; at the same time he was not prepared to say that we ought to sacrifice, for the interest of Canada, the general interest of the colonies. He doubted whether the interest of Canada was so materially promoted by the restrictive system as some Gentlemen supposed. The right hon. Gentleman had said, that for twenty years we had been nursing Canada in a peculiar manner, and he seemed anxious that that colony should not have it in its power to say that it was without an advocate, and without a protector. But our excessive care had been more injurious than neglect. We had undertaken to encourage a peculiar colony, at an enormous expense to every other. The interdict now to be removed had, in some degree, had the effect of co-operating to produce that result. We had given heavy bounties on a particular species of production, and now we were annoyed by our own imprudence, and to continue those bounties longer would only render it more difficult and more dangerous to get rid of them hereafter. For the sake of Canada herself, therefore, the sooner we got rid of the system the better. As to the duties, he must observe, that peculiar injury had been inflicted on the West Indies. His right hon. friend had stated, that his principle of protection was, to hold the balance as even as possible. This was as much as to say, to give as little relief as possible. These were the objections he felt, but he must, at the same time, express his satisfaction as to the character of the measure itself.

Mr. Bernal

said, it was quite a mistake to suppose that the present measure was anything in the nature of a boon; for it was not to be forgotten that the West Indies now derived a great portion of their staves and lumber from the United States, through the neutral island of St. Thomas. The consequence of the restrictions, however, had been, that the Americans would not take our rum and sugar, but required to be paid in hard cash. They had, since the restriction, established distilleries of their own, and no longer took the produce of the West-India islands. The measure was in no respect either a partial or a general concession; and to the West-India islands was merely equitable.

Mr. Herries

explained, that he never asserted that it was a boon. The present measure arose out of a sincere desire on the part of his Majesty's Government to close the negotiation with the United States upon the broad principles of justice. It was never asserted, for a moment, that the Government had any other object in view than protection in framing the schedule; it never was done for fiscal purposes. Though averse from protection in the abstract, he could not, in the present instance, consider it in any other light than as highly expedient.

Mr. Warburton

put it to the House whether 100 per cent ad valorem was a reasonable and moderate protection? That, however, was the protection given to the produce of Canada by this measure. The protection, therefore, which the right hon. Gentleman had alleged to be but moderate, was contrary to the soundest principles of political economy, inasmuch as it was a bounty given to the grower of the dearest article, at the expense of the consumer, who could procure it at a cheaper rate elsewhere but for the protection. He had frequently brought the subject of the loss to the country of our undue encouragement of the Canada timber-trade before the House, with the hope of inducing Ministers to institute an inquiry into it, with a view to a remedy, and should, in the present Session—say the 2nd of December—move for a Select Committee on it, unless some more influential Member took the matter upon him. He confessed, however, as he was an interested party, he should much rather see the matter in the hands of Ministers than undertake the task himself.

Mr. Herries

said, the Committee to inquire into the affairs of Canada would probably be revived, which would answer all useful purposes.

Resolution agreed to.