EXPORTATION OF MACHINERY.

HC Deb 11 May 1826 vol 15 cc1118-22

Mr. Hume

rose, pursuant to notice, to move for leave to bring in a bill "to repeal so much of the 6th of Geo. IV. cap. 107, as relates to the Exportation of Tools and Utensils." He contended, that the neces- sity of allowing the exportation of machinery had been fully substantiated by the evidence given before the committee on that subject. It was proved, that, if, the exportation were permitted, this country would find a market for machinery throughout a very large portion of the world. By adopting a contrary system, they compelled other states to create machinery for themselves, instead of having recourse to Great Britain. But, though the act, part of which he wished to have repealed, forbad the exportation of machinery of particular kinds, it permitted steam-engines, and other articles intimately connected with machinery, to be sent abroad. His object was, to give employment, as far as possible, to a numerous class of workmen—an object of great importance, when it was considered that one portion of our population was in a state approaching to starvation. The laws of the country prevented many persons from being employed in the formation of machines at the present moment, while the masters admitted that they could procure foreign orders to almost any amount, if they dared to take them. There was, he knew, a prejudice against sending out machinery; but it was dying away fast. A petition had been presented to the House on this subject, which was worthy of consideration. It was there stated, that in consequence of these laws, many individuals were obliged to depend on the poor-rates of the parish where they resided, or to seek for employment in other countries. At the present moment, he believed strong inducements were held out to English workmen to go abroad for the purpose of making machines. Now, he conceived it would be more wise to send the machines abroad, and to keep the workmen at home. He had some time since called on the President of the Board of Control to bring in a bill for that purpose. At that time, the right hon. gentleman was not aware of the situation to which the manufacturing classes were on the point of being reduced; for, if he had, he certainly would have made every exertion to have the law repealed. The hon. member concluded by moving for leave to bring in the bill.

Mr. Huskisson

apprehended, that if leave were given to export every species of machinery, without discrimination, considerable mischief must ensue. In some cases, the exportation of machinery had been allowed; namely, in those cases where the framers of machinery did not conceive that their interests could be prejudiced by permitting exportation. There might be, and he feared there was, a number of ingenious artisans out of employ; but, in setting on foot a measure of this kind for their relief, the House should first know how far it was likely to affect the interests of those by whom they were ordinarily employed. He would not oppose the motion for leave to bring in the bill; but, before it proceeded further, it would be necessary that the fact of such a measure having been introduced should be known throughout the country, in order that they might be put in possession of the feelings of those who were most interested in its provisions. If, on that examination, it should appear that any of the great interests to which he had alluded were likely to be prejudiced, he should feel it to be his duty to oppose the measure.

Mr. Birch

deprecated the introduction of any such measure at the present moment; because it must necessarily produce a most unpleasant feeling in the country. It would be much better to wait until the next session of parliament. As to the committee, to which the hon. mover had alluded, he must say, that the whole of the evidence given before it was decidedly ex-parte.

Mr. Littleton

said, that whatever opinion might be entertained of the merits of this question, the present moment was the most unfavourable that could be selected for agitating it. The inquiry which this subject had undergone was the most defective that could be imagined. There had been no evidence on the subject from Lancashire, Glasgow, Birmingham, or from several other places in which this manufacture was carried on. The House had not heard the opinions of Bolton and Watt, and other eminent scientific men engaged in the trade; but from the information which had reached him on the subject, he was led to believe, that the opinions of those gentlemen were not favourable to an unlimited exportation of machinery. A petition was last year presented from Nottingham, full of information on this subject, and to that petition he should wish to refer the hon. member. He would admit, that in time copies of our machines would find their way into foreign countries; but all those hitherto sent there were imperfect, and to repair them workmen were required from this country. It would take a long time to have such machines equal to ours, unless there was allowed a general export of machinery; and if that were once to take place, he believed that a great portion of our industry and capital would follow.

Mr. Philips

said, that if we had no means of employing the manufacturers of machines at home, it would be but common justice to allow them to manufacture for foreign countries. The export of machinery would have the effect not only of giving employment to many of the manufacturers, but would also enable many persons in the trade, who now had machines unemployed, to dispose of them to advantage to other countries. With respect to the question then before the House, he thought that on the principle of free trade, which was carried into so many other branches of our commerce, the export of machinery would not have an injurious tendency; but, under all the circumstances of the present time, it was his opinion that it would be better to refer the whole subject to a committee next session.

Mr. Huskisson

said, it would be hopeless to attempt to carry any measure into effect on this subject in the present session.

Mr. Secretary Peel

thought that a dispassionate consideration of the subject could not be expected at the present period. The hon. member had wished for the opinions of practical men on this subject; but he would ask, whether it would be proper to withdraw practical man from other and more important business at this period? If he were an advocate for the measure proposed by the hon. member, he thought he should best promote the object in view, by requesting him to postpone it.

Captain Maberly

expressed a hope, that under the circumstances stated, the hon. member would not press his motion at present.

Mr. Hume

said, he had brought forward the motion in consequence of the petitions which had been presented to the House from the manufacturers of machines, complaining of being out of employment, and praying for relief. He did hope, that the principle which he advocated would at last be adopted; but as some hon. members thought the discussion of the subject would increase irritation in the minds of the manufacturers, and as he had no wish to add to that which already existed, he would, with the leave of the House, withdraw his motion.

The motion was then withdrawn.