NAVY ESTIMATES. (Hansard, 22 March 1822)

§ Mr. Hume
said, in the committee on these estimates last year, a great deal of conversation had taken place respecting this vote. Then, as now, his principal objection to the vote, was, as to that part of it which applied to Sheerness. Last session he submitted that they ought to vote no more money towards carrying on the works at Sheerness, until they had received sufficient information as to the propriety of continuing those works. In 1814, when these great works were first begun in our dock-yards, the estimate laid on the table for Sheerness, was 824,992l.; but the actual cost was found to be 1,355,000l., being about 500,000l. more than the amount stated in the original estimate. It appeared, by papers before the House, that to complete these works, would require, exclusive of the vote for the present year; 618,000l. If to this sum they added the total vote for the year, which was 65,000l., the amount required for their completion (supposing even that the expense should not exceed the estimates), would be 683,000l. so that the works at Sheerness, when finished, would have cost the country altogether2,038,000l. When these works were first begun, some difference of opinion existed among the government-boards whether the proposed dock-yards should not be established at Purfleet rather than Sheerness; but finally, the preference was given to Sheerness. At that time, the means now possessed by us were not exerted. Now we employed, on all occasions, steam vessels, for taking line-of-battle ships from one station to another, as might be deemed necessary. By these vessels, line-of-battle ships, and East Indiamen of the largest class were towed against wind and tide with the most perfect safety and success. No place that could be selected possessed greater capabilities for docks than Purfleet. There was nothing but chalk to excavate, and the work would have been dry and secure. 1239 But at Sheerness accident after accident had occurred. The building were raised literally upon a quicksand; and in every instance, it was in the first place necessary to drive piles into this sand. In January, 1820, a very large portion of the new works was broken down by a sudden irruption of the sea, which accident occasioned to the country an additional expense of several hundred thousand pounds. He would here beg the gentlemen opposite to explain one singular circumstance. In 1820, the total amount necessary to complete these works, was estimated at 171,000l.; but the actual cost proved to be 200,000l. and upwards, for all the yards. But the amounts which they had been in the meanwhile called on to pay for these works, in all the yards, would be little short of 954,000l. No doubt all this was to the great benefit of the persons employed. He had been told by engineers of considerable ability, that they doubted not only the utility of the works so far as they had gone, but the utility of the works so far as they had gone, but the utility also of continuing them. He had seen estimate, by which it appeared that if even government were to commence new and extensive works at Purfleet, they would not require so much money as was necessary to complete the old works at Sheerness. When we possessed a great navy, it might have been very proper to accommodate them with additional room; but now, in the seventh year of peace, he understood that we had more docks than we had ships to put in to them. He had shown that the expense of the works at Sheerness, when they should be complete, would be upwards of 2,000,000l., assuming even that the estimate would not be exceeded. No single board ought to be intrusted with the management and direction of such expensive undertakings as these. A committee ought to be appointed by that House, for the purpose of considering their utility, and of bringing before them, not merely the government engineers, but other engineers of ability, in order to have the full benefit of their opinions; and he should propose, that the House would not vote more than 20,000l. or 30,000l. a year for these works, until a report should have been obtained from such committee. He should at present move to reduce this vote by 50,000l.; being the estimated amount for the old works at Sheerness.

§ Sir J. Osborn
said, that with respect to Sheerness, 50,000l. was all that was require- 1240 ed to complete the new works. A sum of 15,000l. additional was required for building a smithery. As to the utility, or otherwise, of Sheerness, as a station for docks, he should leave the House to decide upon that point; but he thought it preferable to a place which the hon. gentleman called Purfleet; meaning he presumed, Northfleet. With respect to the Breakwater, he could not agree with the hon. gentleman as to the propriety of the course which he suggested. The hon. gentleman, by means of large grants, would wish to have the works completed in two or three years. He was convinced that if that course were followed, it would occasion, not a saving, but an increase of expense.

§ Sir J. Yorke
contended, that the works at Sheerness were undertaken under the immediate direction of most able and experienced men. He had only to mention the names of Mr. Watt, captain Huddart, and Mr. Jessop. The works notwithstanding the observations that had been made, would stand the test of severe criticism. Of this expenditure it was to be observed, that every shilling was spent in the country, and in some way or other found its way back into the Exchequer, and the hon. member should recollect, that his constituents were not a little benefitted, as the Aberdeen granite was much employed. When they recollected the various instances of unprofitable expenditure—the twenty millions spent in St. Domingo—the twenty millions lost in the Austrian loan—when they cast their eyes to the course of the Medway, and observed a certain hill, on which a lazaretto was erected at an expense of one million, of which not a vestige remained, the whole having been sold for 10,000l., he really thought the hon. member had pitched upon one of the least objectionable parts of the ministerial expenditure. Before the improvements were undertaken, there was scarcely a dock in Sheerness and Chatham fit for a ship of the line, and as for Chatham, the river below was so shoal and intricate, that even when ships had been repaired and were fit for sea, they had grounded on their moorings, and were obliged to be returned to dock. The works were now completed, and the sum proposed was merely to erect, a wait to separate the great basin from Powder-monkey-bay, without which it was supposed the water could not be let in without danger of a blow-up. The great basin 1241 had now twenty-seven feet at the mouth, and would now admit a first rate with all her guns and stores. As to Plymouth Breakwater, it had already been found to be of the greatest service.