HC Deb 30 May 1821 vol 5 cc1041-3
Mr. Maberly

rose to bring forward his promised motion with regard to the interest paid upon Irish Treasury-bills, compared to that upon Exchequer bills. The Treasury bills in Ireland were to raise money for the public uses, in the same manner as the Exchequer bills; but they were not sold in open market in Ireland, as the Exchequer bills were in this country; and were issued, he presumed, by special favour as the Bank of Ireland thought proper. In 1815, the unfunded debt of Ireland was about 2,500,000l.; in 1816, 2,500,000l.; in 1817,5,000,000l.; in 1818, it exceeded 5,600,000l.; and in 1819 it was nearly 5,000,000l. Up to 1818, the Bank received 5 per cent interest upon these bills; and in 1819 and 1820, they had 4 per cent. In the early part of 1815, the rate of interest upon Exchequer bills was 3½d. per diem; or 5l. 6s. 3d. per cent per arm. In the latter part of that year it was 3¼d. or 4l. 18s. 10d. In 1816, it was 3d. in 1817, it was 2½d. or 3l.16s. 2d. per ann.; and afterwards, in the same year, 2d. or 3l. 0s. 10d. On the sale of these bills, too, it must be observed, that the government expected a premium of 5s. which of course ought to be considered in abatement of the interest. From the course pursued, he calculated that the public had lost in 1816, near 12,500l.; in 1817, 92,000l.; in 1818, 125,000l.; in 1819, 109,000l.; in 1820, 94,000l.; forming a total of upwards of 400,000l. in a few years, and being nearly equal to 500,000l., which the Bank of Ireland lent at 4 per cent upon the renewal of their charter. His present object was prospective, and in the hope of preventing, in future transactions, an expenditure which he thought need not be incurred, he would move, "That it is expedient that the same rate of Interest should be paid on Irish Treasury Bills as on Exchequer Bills."

The Chancellor of the Exchequer

said, it was but fair that Ireland should be placed in as advantageous a situation as this country, with respect to loans, and it certainly was not in a better. Upon the repeal of the war taxes in 1816 government was under the necessity of making a loan from the Bank of Ireland, the capital of which had since been reduced from five to one million, while the interest had been reduced from five to four per cent, and if the remaining one million were now to be paid off, a loss would be incurred upon the exchange of at least two per cent, by which, of course, the public would suffer, although the means of paying it off might be borrowed at 3 per cent. By this proceeding also it would be recollected that one million must be taken from the circulation of England to be transferred to Ireland. The interest upon the unfunded debt had been reduced from five to three per cent, which reduction had produced a saving to the country of no less than 600,000l. a year.

Mr. Maberly

said, that if a wise policy were pursued, there would be no necessity for the Banks of Ireland or England holding the Treasury bills in question, at a rate of interest different from that;, at which the merchants of London were paid. If there was a man who could say conscientiously that the public ought to pay 12,000l. a year more to the Bank of Ireland than would be required to pay other individuals, for holding these bills, he would give up his motion.

The House divided: 64. Ayes, 31; Noes, 64.

List of the Minority.
Baring, A. Maberly, J.
Bury, lord Moore, P.
Becher, W. W. Martin, J.
Bernal, R. Newport, sir J.
Chaloner, R. Philips, G.
Colborne, R. Philips, J.
Calvert, N. Robinson, sir G.
Davies, col. Smith, J.
Evans, W. Smith, W.
Gordon, R. Mackintosh, sir J.
Grattan, J. Scarlett, J.
Hornby, E. Tierney, rt. hon. G.
Hume, J. Wood, alderman
James, W. Whitbread, S. C.
Lockhart, J. J. TELLERS.
Milton, lord Grant, J. P.
Monck, J. B. Maberly, J.