HC Deb 03 March 1817 vol 35 cc837-41
Mr. Bootle Wilbraham

rose for the purpose of presenting a Petition, numerously signed by the magistrates, gentry, clergy, freeholders, and other inhabitants of the hundred of Blackburn, in the county palatine of Lancaster, expressing their abhorrence of the conduct of those who, under the mask of reform, were endeavouring to subvert the constitution; who had emissaries at work all over the kingdom, endeavouring, by every art, to inflame the populace, and stir them up to acts of violence, and carrying about petitions ready made for the purpose of procuring the people by any means to sign them. The petition prayed the House not to consider that the feelings of the great body of the people were expressed in such pe- titions. The hon. gentleman then stated that the meeting at which this petition was agreed to, was most numerously and respectably attended, and that it might be considered as expressing the sentiments of the great body of the inhabitants of Lancashire. He then mentioned that this meeting was first appointed to be held in. the Town Hall at Preston, but that on the day fixed for its taking place, the hall-doors were no sooner opened, than a great body of the populace rushed in and filled the hall to the exclusion of the more respectable part of the people; and that when the place of assembly was thus filled, an address was agreed to, which was quite contrary to the general feeling of the people.

Lord Stanley

could not let this opportunity pass by without adverting to what had fallen from his hon. friend. With regard to the signatures to the petition, they were in the highest degree respectable, and he believed the petition spoke the sentiments of those individuals who signed it. But he had to learn now, for the first time, that the sentiments of any body of gentlemen, however respectable, of any hundred of a large county, were to be taken for the sentiments of that county, in opposition to the sentiments of a meeting called by public advertisement, where an address had been agreed to, and signed by the high sheriff of the county in his public capacity. The meeting in question was very numerously attended, and, among others, by those who signed the requisition, but they were completely defeated with respect to the address they brought forward, an amended address being carried by a large majority. He was aware that it might be said that many of them were not freeholders; but this was not a meeting of freeholders—it was a general meeting of the county. The result of the determination of that meeting, however, would not come before the House; it was an address to the Prince Regent. Meetings of the county of Lancaster for petitioning were seldom called, on account of the extent and population of the county, and political opinions being so much divided. He protested against this petition being considered as the petition of a meeting of the county of Lancaster.

Mr. Cawthorne

wished to bear testimony to the respectability of the signatures to the petition. With respect to the meeting at Preston, it had no doubt been regularly convened, on a requisition numerously and respectably signed; but the doors of the hall hail hardly been opened, when in rushed a rabble of cotton-spinners and weavers, and others of the very lowest order of people, with Mr. Casey, a man from Liverpool, at the head of them, an Irish renegado—[loud cries of Hear! from the opposition side]. He would not be deterred from saying what he thought of this person; he had heard him speak at Liverpool and other places, and he believed him to be as mischievous a man as existed in this country. The cotton-spinners and manufacturers of Preston did bear down by their voice those who called the meeting, and voted an amendment to the address proposed by them. The high sheriff, though this amended address was at variance with his private opinion, could not do otherwise than sign it. The address of the meeting at Preston was, therefore, not the address of the freeholders of the county, but of the cotton-spinners and weavers of Preston, of whom any person might collect together any number whenever he pleased. He would venture to assert, that there were not twenty freeholders who agreed to the amended address.

Mr. Brougham

said, that it had been observed, that to be praised by him who was the object of all men's commendations was a rare felicity. This was not a felicity, however, which it seemed was to be enjoyed by, the worthy gentleman, Mr. Casey, whose name had, in so unaccountable a manner, been brought forward on this occasion by the hon. member,—he had not had the good fortune to be praised by a gentleman, whose name was the object of ail men's commendations. He would venture to say, that an individual who bore a more respectable character among his friends, or on 'Change, did not exist than Mr. Casey. He had, indeed, met with misfortunes in trade, but he should have thought these misfortunes would rather have screened him from, than exposed him to, objections, which till he had met with misfortunes, had never been heard of Whether the principles of Mr. Casey were or were not mischievous was a matter, the determination of which must depend on the opinion which every man entertained with respect to the particular question which now divided the country. That he was a powerful advocate of those principles no man would deny—and if he had not also been a successful advocate of them, his name would never have been heard in that House. That he had transferred his residence from Ireland to this country was a most unusual ground of accusation against him; it was an accusation which, if it were to be allowed any weight, might be found very inconvenient to many persons in England from that country, and the more so, if on leaving that country, they also left their principles behind them [Hear, hear!]. He had only to say that he knew this gentleman by report some time before knowing him personally, but he was now personally acquainted with him; and there were other members in the House besides himself, who could give him the praise of being as steady and consistent in his politics, as he was amiable and respectable in private life. A most extraordinary attack had been made on the meeting at Preston. It had been said, that it did not speak the sense of the county—and why?—Because it did not speak the sense of the mover and seconder of the first address. In vain would any such objection have been urged if those who called the meeting had carried their object. His information came from a quarter as respectable as that from which the hon. gentlemen opposite derived theirs, and it was directly the reverse of what they had stated. Very many freeholders were at the meeting, and a decided majority of those present were against the address, and in favour of the amendment; and this had induced the sheriff, though it was contrary to his own private opinion, to sign the amended address.

Mr. Baring

could not help saying, that it was extremely desirable that county meetings should be regulated by some legislative enactments. He knew, from experience, that petitions often came before the House, as speaking the sense of meetings of large counties, which only spoke the sentiments of the rabble of the county town. With respect to this particular case, that the sheriff signed the address, was all the satisfaction that the House could have of its speaking the sense of the county of Lancaster. But speaking in general, he had no hesitation in saying, that the country was exposed to great mischief from the labours of a few active Jacobins, who went about influencing the lower orders of people to attend public meetings. From the way petitions were carried, of which not merely the gentlemen of a county, but even the respectable tradesmen generally disapproved, he thought that in all times, and in all situations of the country, it would be ex- tremely desirable to regulate the mode in which meetings should be held. There ought to be some regulation to secure the House against delusion.

Mr. Birch

said it was rather too much to state that the sentiments of the present petition were the sentiments of the freeholders of the county of Lancaster. The hon. member for Lancaster had talked of the cotton-spinners and weavers who composed the meeting at Preston. But he would ask him how many cotton-spinners and weavers had been influenced by their masters to sign the present petition? [Not one, from Mr. Cawthorne]. This was a bold assertion. It did not become that hon. gentleman to talk of Irish renegadoes. He had never heard any thing against the gentleman whom he had so characterized, either as a merchant or a man; nothing which could lead him to infer that he ought to be considered as a mischievous person.

Mr. Bootle Wilbraham

said, that, in what he had observed, when he presented the petition, he meant not to make any personal allusion. He, however, must declare it to be a notorious fact, that the Preston meeting was irregularly conducted. The room appropriated for the purpose was of very confined extent, and, before those who had signed the requisition made their appearance, it was almost completely occupied.

The petition was ordered to lie on the table.