§ Mr. Bathurst, after a few words upon the number of Aliens at present in this country, and the necessity of arming ministers with further powers, moved for leave to bring in a Bill to provide further regulations respecting aliens.
Mr. Ponsonbyacknowledged, that he entertained a great jealousy towards those powers intrusted to the Government by the Alien Acts, and thought that no ground existed at present for granting any of an extraordinary nature. The reason for which those Acts were originally passed was, to obviate the injury that might result from Aliens endeavouring to propagate in this country sentiments and principles subversive of good order, and hostile to the Government; but surely such apprehensions could not be seriously entertained at the present period. If Aliens transgressed the ordinary criminal laws of the realm, those laws were equal 656 to their punishment, without arming the Government with extraordinary powers, which might be exercised from the suggestions of private malice, and were, from their nature, open to abuse, in consequence of misrepresentations difficult to be examined into. The only ground urged by the right hon. mover was, that there were at present a great number of Aliens in the kingdom; but could it be said that they were for the purpose of forming an army, to carry on war within the kingdom? In the present crisis, it might be more naturally expected that Aliens friendly to this country, and hostile to the present Ruler of France, would come to England. From these no injurious movements could be apprehended. He was convinced that these measures had been greatly misapplied, and had been made the instruments of private malice, while the Government was imposed upon. He, therefore, felt indisposed to permit the Bill to be brought in, without taking the sense of the House.
§ Mr. Bathurstsaid, he had not entered into details upon the subject, because he did not think that the necessity of the Bill would be doubted at the present crisis. It was not at all impossible that persons might be sent from France to this country, or to Ireland, to estrange the population and weaken its allegiance. The principle of the Bill had already been several times recognised by Parliament.
§ Mr. Whitbreadsaid, that the right hon. gentleman had talked of the measure being necessary in the present situation of the country; but neither he nor any of his Majesty's ministers could inform the House what that situation was. He bad uniformly opposed the Alien Acts, thinking them the instruments of great abuse and cruelty. He was sure that minister; had been imposed upon frequently, and that they had paid money to emigrants who were holding correspondence will the enemy, while they sent innocent foreigners out of the country. Most probably upon this Government in a great degree depended the question of peace o war—the Continent would be guided by it; but before such a question was deter mined, it seemed to him a litte too early to bring in a Bill for the regulation o aliens, that war only could justify. He denied that there was any danger that the minds of the people of Ireland would be corrupted by aliens, or that ministers bat not adequate means of meeting such a evil without this Bill.
§ Mr. Dennis Brownesaid, that while a Jacobin government, assisted by an over-whelmning military power, existed in France, the ministers should be armed with extraordinary powers relative to aliens. Such, he feared, would be particularly necessary in Ireland, from the feelings too prevalent in that kingdom. He thought that if the Alien Act did not resist in Ireland, the hon. gentleman who spoke last would have to ask other questions relative to that country than he found necessary at present.
§ Mr. Bathurstsaid, that it was impossible for ministers to state particular cases, when they came to the House for a measure like the present; such conduct would defeat the very object in view.
§ Mr. Whitbreadsaid, that in order to have the matter more fully explained upon a future day, he should divide the House.
§ Mr. Bathurstremonstrated, observing that such a proceeding could only cause useless delay. The measure could be debated in its future stages.
§ Mr. Whitbreadindicated his intention of persevering. With regard to what the hon. gentleman opposite had said upon the Jacobin Government of France, all be (Mr. W.) could observe in reply was, that the Congress of Vienna had been an arch-manufacturer of Jacobins.
§ Mr. R. Wardsaid, that if the hon. gentleman took advantage of the then state of the House merely for the sake of a delay of 24 or perhaps 48 hours, he would prove himself the greatest friend of ministers by such a proceeding.
§ Mr. Whitbreadsaid, that if he should prove a friend to the present ministers, it vests more than he intended to be.
§ The House then divided: Yeas, 24; Noes, 3. As there were not forty members present, the House adjourned, and the motion, was of course lost.