HC Deb 30 May 1811 vol 20 cc365-7

The report of this Bill having been brought up,

Mr. Parnell

rose to move a clause to give to the Catholic Militiaman legal security for the exercise of his religion in this country. He was ready to allow that the amendments which had been made to the Bill in the Committee had removed some of the objections which he originally entertained. By them the Catholic Militia officer would be protected against the penalties and disabilities of the Test Act, and the Acts of George 3. Still, however, the Bill was not what it ought to be, so far as the Catholic private soldier was concerned. Though the right hon. gent. said he was willing to put him in this country on the same footing in respect to the exercise of his religion, as he was now in Ireland, and that a general order would be issued immediately by the commander in chief for that purpose, he (Mr. Parnell) would maintain that such a security was not a sufficient one—because even in Ireland the Catholic soldier did not stand in the condition in which he ought to be in this respect; for though the Irish Act of 1793 enabled the Catholic to serve in the army, the constructive privilege conferred by that act as to religious worship, was taken away by the mutiny act. By this Act, which is annually passed by parliament, every commanding officer in Ireland is enabled to order the Catholic soldier to attend the Protestant service, and in case of disobedience of his orders, he is enabled to inflict the punishment of fining and imprisoning, in a summary way; or to bring the soldier who disobeys him before a court martial for the general crime of disobedience of orders. This was a power which does at this moment exist in Ireland. To give, therefore, to the Catholic Militia-man, when in this country, only the same privileges as he possesses in Ireland, was to leave him subject to a punishment by law for refusing to attend the service of the established church. He endeavoured to remove this great injustice by the amendment which he proposed to the Mutiny Bill, when last before this House; the reasons for adopting a clause such as he now proposed, were still stronger than any which be could urge in favour of that amendment. By this Bill Catholics are compelled by the ballot to serve in the Irish Militia, and those who may be hereafter admitted into the militia are compelled to serve in England. All persons entering into the army by enlistment did so with their eyes open, and knowing the restraints to which they would be subject.—But this Bill was one which compelled the service of the Irish Catholics in England. Was it not then but just to make provision in such a Bill that he should at least enjoy, in reward for his service, the unquestionable right of exercising his religion according to the ceremonies of his own church.—But the House should observe, that the Catholic soldier would not enjoy the same protection under a general order of the commander in chief in this country as he does in Ireland. Ireland being a Catholic country, he had there every facility of attending the places of Catholic worship. He was also sure of protection and redress in case the orders of the commander in chief were isolated. Here, on the contrary, places of Catholic worship were but few, and if a commanding officer thought proper to disregard the general order, there would be no chance of his injuries being known or redressed. Besides, proceeding by a general order was very objectionable, as it was an Act dispensing with the law of the land. The Mutiny Act makes it legal to punish the soldier for refusing to attend the Protestant church service. The general order says, that pars of the law shall not be enforced. What was this but to dispense with an act of parliament and to violate the Bill of Rights? It was also to be objected to this way of proceeding, that there was no probability that it would afford the Catholic a permanent and effectual security. The repetition of these orders proved their failure to do that which they were designed to do. In Ireland there had been four general orders of commanders of the forces since 1S07. Each successive order referred to the violation of the preceding one, and thus proved their inefficacy. An hon. bart. (sir J. C. Hippesley) who was absent through indisposition, had authorised him to say, that in the western district of this kingdom, four successive orders had been issued at his instance, and each of them had failed to give the Catholic protection.—Under all these circumstances, therefore, he should submit the following clause to the House, as the only way by which complete security could be given to the Catholic for the full and free exercise of his religion.

"And be it further enacted, that it shall and may be lawful for all persons professing the Roman Catholic religion, serving as commissioned and non-commissioned officers, drummers and private men, in any regiment, battalion or corps of Irish Militia, which shall be called upon to serve in Great Britain, to attend the celebration of divine service, according to the ceremonies of the Roman Catholic Church, in as foil and free a manner as Protestants (being officers or soldiers) are now permitted to attend the celebration of divine service according to the rites of the Church of England.—And that no such commissioned, or non-commissioned officer, or private man in any regiment, battalion or corps of Irish Militia, which shall be called upon to serve in Great Britain, shall be liable, under any provision of the Mutiny Act, to any punishment whatsoever for refusing to attend divine service or sermon, according to the rites of the Church of England."

Mr. Secretary Ryder

had stated it to be his intention to place the Catholic soldier on the same fooling here as in Ireland; and on such a footing, he contended, he was placed by the Bill as it at present stood. Immediately after the passing of the Bill it was intended that an order should be issued from the office of the commander in chief, allowing each individual to attend that place of worship which he might select. The Irish Catholic had no greater security in Ireland for the enjoyment of his religion, and therefore the proposed clause was unnecessary. For that reason, and for that alone, he should oppose its being introduced.

The clause was supported by sir John Newport, Colonel Bagwell, Mr. W. Smith, Mr. Herbert, Mr. Babington, and Mr. Elliot; and opposed by Mr. Goulburne, Dr. Duigenan, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer; after which it was negatived without a division. The report was then agreed to, and the Bill was ordered to be read a third time on Wednesday.