§ Exactly at four o'clock,
Lord Porchestermoved that the order of the day for the House going into a Committee on the policy and conduct of the Expedition to the Scheldt be read.
Mr. Whartoncould not think the conduct of the noble lord, and of gentlemen who sat on the same side of the House with him, at all consistent with the principles they professed. They boasted that they were actuated solely by a view to the good of the country, and he had no reason to doubt their sincerity, but at the same time they were for pushing on the Inquiry now before the House to the prejudice and delay of other important business, in which the public interest was deeply concerned. He took it for granted that their real object was the removal from office of his Majesty's present ministers. If that was a measure calculated to do good to the public, the advantage to be derived from it could only be of a prospective nature; while by the delay of other business requiring instant dispatch, immediate loss and inconvenience would be occasioned. There were now before the House for discussion, on this night, regulations of trade and revenue, which must be interrupted by acceding to the motion of the noble lord, and from such delay considerable 538 public inconvenience must ensue. Thus were the noble lord and his friends, while they professed to study and promote the public good, pressing on the Inquiry at certain detriment to the country. It could not, he submitted, signify whether the dismissal of his Majesty's ministers, which was with gentlemen on the opposite side the summum bonum, was carried atone time or at another; but if the Distillery regulations, which were by law to exist only for forty days after the meeting of parliament, and of which about thirty were already run, were allowed to expire, great inconvenience and detriment to the public would ensue.
§ Mr. Whitbreadsaid, that in two points only he must coincide with the hon. gent., namely, that to-morrow was future, and also that his noble friend, and those who sat on the same side of the House with him, thought they had the good of their country at heart. He begged the hon. gent.'s pardon: he must agree with him in one other remark; that they wished for the removal of the present ministers. They did so, and not only did they desire their removal, but their punishment also. The hon. gent. said, it could be of little consequence when this was effected. When, however, they saw the right hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer associated with earl Chatham at the head of the Ordnance, and lord Mulgraveat the head of the Admiralty, concerting measures for sending out fresh troops to Portugal and Cadiz, was it not reasonable that they should desire to bring the inquiry to as speedy a termination as possible. They did not, however, wish that other business should be postponed. On the contrary, delay seemed altogether to be the object of the gentlemen on the other side, and a studied system of machinery seemed to have been adopted for this purpose. He begged to remind the hon. gent., that his noble Iriend was in possession of a vote of the House, giving the precedence to his motion, which vote had not been rescinded. It was somewhat remarkable to observe the unwillingness gentlemen opposite shewed to proceed in the inquiry. At ten o'clock the other night, their constitutions were so exhausted, they could not submit to have a few questions put to sir Eyre Coote; finding themselves, however, nearly run, one right hon. gent. the secretary for the Home Department got up and made a speech, which, having heard of such a thing as debating against time, he must 539 from the tone of enunciation, and every other character that belonged to it, have supposed to be one of this kind, till the right hon. gent. being warned by some of his friends that a miscalculation had been made, he sat down. The hon. gent. (Mr. Wharton) then (the hour being much farther advanced,) brought forward a number of Resolutions for Miscellaneous Services, not one of which need necessarily be called for till after Easter. And, at two o'clock in the morning, those same gentlemen, who, at 10 o'clock, while the Inquiry was proceeding, were dying with fatigue, found themselves perfectly able to proceed to the discussion of a number of Irish propositions. Now, at four o'clock in the afternoon, the noble lord called on the Chair to have the order of the day read. All they desired was to proceed in the Inquiry till eight o'clock, after which the other business might proceed without impediment. This was a point he must particularly assert; and he should see if the House of Commons having decided on the propriety of this Inquiry taking place at that particular time, were resolved to persevere in it, or were content, to suffer an accused and suspected administration to defeat the Resolutions of that House.
§ Mr. Stephendid not consider this to be a question whether inquiry was intended or likely to be defeated. If he did he should readily concur in the motion of the noble lord, for reading the order of day. It was said, that one object of the inquiry was to turn out ministers; he believed there was another object which went hand in hand with it, namely, the placing certain other gentlemen in their situations. This might create an impatience natural enough on the part of the gentlemen who stood in this situation; but he could not consent, that, to gratify their feelings the whole public business of the country should be adjourned. When he was farther told that punishment was expected to follow, as well as removal from office, he felt himself still more imperiously called .on, not to decide without the most dispassionate and impartial consideration. When the House heard that they might be called on not only to remove ministers from office, but even to impeach and punish them, they would see additional ground for calm deliberation, and feel convinced that they should not proceed rashly, or without having fully and maturely considered the evidence on which they were to decide.
Lord G. L. Gowerthought the fair ques- 540 tion was, whether the House would support its own order for going now into the Committee? And he saw no fair ground of objection to it.
§ Mr. Manners Suttondid not suppose that the motion of the noble lord was made with the view to prevent the Distillery bill from coming on; the only question was whether the one or the other was most fit to be first discussed. The necessity of a speedy disposal of the Distillery bill must be apparent to every one. Was it clear that four hours would serve to exhaust the evidence of lord Chatham? Last night the evidence finished at ten o'clock, but then there was an alter discussion of several hours; and did gentlemen not think that there might be the same sort of discussion to night as to the particular time at which it should come on again.
Lord Porchesterdeclared, that next to the object of his motion for supporting the order of the House, was his wish to accommodate lord Chatham, for whose examination this day was set apart; and to whom he had given an intimation that his lordship's attendance would be expected. Lord Chatham had assured him, that the ill state of his health would not allow of a very late attendance. His lordship was now in the lobby, waiting to be called in. His own anxiety, therefore, was chiefly on account of lord Chatham, to whom an unnecessary detention till one or two in the morning would not be very kind; and this too, for no other purpose than to shew that ministers had influence enough upon a new division, to set aside an order of the House.
The Chancellor of the Exchequercould not consent to give a silent vote on the present occasion. His noble friend (lord G. L. Cower), he was satisfied, could not have been present at the beginning of the discussion, else he could not have thought the proposition of the noble lord opposite so very fair and reasonable. It might so turn out that the examination of lord Chatham might not be finished within the time appointed, and would it be consistent with justice to any of the parties, that the evidence should be interrupted the moment it was eight o'clock, probably in the midst of some important explanation?
§ Mr. Tierneysaw no cause whatever, nor any change of circumstances since last night, that could make it necessary to forego the order agreed on.
The House then divided upon the motion of lord Porchester.—For the motion 136 Against it 180. Majority 44.