HL Deb 03 May 1990 vol 518 cc1133-5

3.7 p.m.

Baroness Burton of Coventry asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether the meeting of European Civil Aviation Conference Ministers on 24th April considered the draft report of its task force on the scope for integration of European air traffic control systems and, if so, what action and decisions were agreed.

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Transport attended the second meeting of the European Civil Aviation Conference (ECAC) Transport Ministers on 24th April to consider the report of its task force. In response to a UK initiative, the transport ministers agreed a programme to increase air traffic capacity in Europe by integrating air traffic control systems and improving the air traffic route network.

The programme will be managed by Eurocontrol and will be overseen by a group of senior officials from participating states, reporting to their respective governments. Ministers reaffirmed that they hoped all ECAC states would join Eurocontrol. Ministers agreed that they would meet again in the second half of 1991 to review progress.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, I wish I could he more enthusiastic with regard to the UK initiative. Will the Minister say why the Government have set their face so resolutely against a unified air traffic control system in Europe, which is what the airlines want, and instead agreed to the staggered system of reforms? Is the Minister aware that if we wait until 1998 for harmonisation, which the Government and the noble Viscount described as the next best thing to a unified system, it will be a triumph for bureaucratic advisers and the loss of a great opportunity?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I wish the noble Baroness could be more satisfied with my answers. However, I must tell her that the Government and the Civil Aviation Authority consider that it would be impracticable in the immediate future to establish a unified air traffic control system in Europe. Substantial political, defence, legal and industrial relations problems would have to be resolved which would delay the introduction of the improvements that are urgently needed to handle the forecast growth in traffic. Those objectives can be achieved more rapidly through the integration programme agreed by ECAC transport ministers.

Lord Young of Dartington

My Lords, is the noble Viscount satisfied with that answer?

Viscount Davidson

Of course I am, my Lords; it is a very good one.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, among all the information that the noble Viscount has within his files, can he tell the House whether it is true that air traffic control in Europe will still be handled by 42 different centres in 1998 instead of the six or eight which will be needed?

Further, am I correct in believing that the transport ministers themselves rejected the proposals for a unified air traffic control system by saying that the proposals raised insurmountable obstacles including some of national sovereignty? Does the noble Viscount realise—I am sure that the House does—that until there is some political will to have these matters dealt with we shall have no progress at all?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I can tell the noble Baroness that so far as the United Kingdom is concerned there is the political will. Looking to the future, more countries which belong to the ECAC will be joining Eurocontrol in the near future. ECAC ministers have committed themselves to a phased programme which will give significant results well before 1998. Improvements in air traffic control systems are continuously being made and the CAA already has an investment programme worth about £100 million a year. The problem is that in the high density traffic areas, which include the UK, France, Germany, and the Benelux countries, harmonisation is targeted to be completed by 1995, but in the low density areas, which are generally less well equipped, priority will initially be given to increasing investment and that will be followed by harmonisation.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, that is a lot of information, but will the noble Viscount answer the question that I put to him? Can he tell the House whether it is correct that by 1998 air traffic control in Europe will still be handled by 42 different centres instead of by the six or eight that will be needed? If the noble Viscount does not have that information in his papers, will he write to me and put a copy in the Library?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I do not have that information and I do not wish to speculate at this moment about 1998. I shall therefore write to the noble Baroness and place a copy in the Library.

Lord Orr-Ewing

My Lords, is my noble friend aware of the great belief that, without much "push" behind us, these matters involving a huge bureaucracy have been allowed to go on since the end of the war? Can we not make use of our sophisticated military radar until such time as the civil people get their act together?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I shall certainly pass on my noble friend's suggestion to my right honourable friend.