HL Deb 25 July 1986 vol 479 cc492-5

11.24 a.m.

Lord Teviot

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the second Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows: To ask Her Majesty's Government what attempts are being made by London Regional Transport to increase the efficiency and quality of its service.

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, when London Regional Transport was established in 1984 the Government set it a number of objectives relating to the efficiency and quality of its service. These included making the service more attractive to the public, securing better value for money and involving the private sector in the provision of services where that is more efficient. We are pleased that they have made substantial progress in meeting these and other objectives.

Lord Teviot

My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. London Regional Transport is a happier story than that of the National Bus Company. I should be grateful if my noble friend will tell me what technological advances have been made by London Regional Transport recently and of any innovative bus services that it intends to put on the market.

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, there have been a number of technological improvements to help service quality. One of those has been the docklands light railway which will come into operation next year. There will be a new ticketing system for the underground by 1988 which will greatly improve the issue, checking and control of tickets and passes. Electronic bus priority systems are being tested to help traffic flow at roundabouts and traffic lights. The Government are also helping with four assessments of the worst road problems in the London area. With regard to innovative services, a number of things have been happening. In particular, better use has been made of one-person operated buses.

Lord Molloy

My Lords, is the Minister aware that, despite the Government's hopes in 1984, the facts are that since LRT took over there has been a 3 million-mile cut in routage; garages have been closed; bus crews sacked to join the dole queue—to cause more trouble for his noble friend on the Front Bench—and the London Regional Passenger Committee has said: Demand has gone up; frequency of service has gone down"? Finally, is he aware that there has been a 35 per cent. increase in London Regional Transport costs for an inferior service?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I must tell the noble Lord that he is completely wrong. Since 1984, unit costs have been significantly reduced and revenue costs have been halved in one year to £97 million. He will of course recall that the GLC had plans for revenue subsidy of £245 million. Capital investment has been increased to £216 million in 1986–87 compared with GLC plans for only £150 million. Fares have been held broadly in line with inflation. The financial burden on the ratepayer and taxpayer has been reduced.

Lord Boyd-Carpenter

My Lords, from the serenity of my noble friend's official car, has he been able to observe the deterioration in services on the district line particularly in respect of breakdowns of trains and escalators?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, no, I have not. From my car, my bus, my bicycle or my feet, I find it difficult to understand what is going on in the underground. I shall note my noble friend's point.

Lord Underhill

My Lords, does the noble Earl appreciate that London Regional Transport has already put out to tender some 56 bus routes? They are not subsidised services. Does he recall that I sent him details of strong complaints made in the Epping Forest District Council area of lateness and bad service as a result of the transfer of some 12 services and the closing of the Loughton bus garage? Can he explain to the House the logic of LRT putting unsubsidised services out to tender? Does it mean that LRT regards itself as inefficient, or is it because some of the organisations which have taken over the services are paying lower wages and offering worse conditions than LRT, and possibly inadequate pension schemes?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, no, LRT does not consider itself to be inefficient. It believes that where tendering is feasible and will benefit bus service users it should be undertaken. I agree with the noble Lord that there was a local problem in Epping. I recall telling him that that was being tackled. LRT is conscious of any problems that arise and sees that they are remedied as soon as possible.

Lord Kennet

My Lords, how long will it be before all underground stations have useful devices such as the one now at St. James's Park, which tells one when the next three trains are coming and where they are going?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I do not know the answer to that question. As the noble Lord will be aware, recently there has been such a substantial increase in the number of people using the underground that I am sure LRT will want to improve the service even more.

Lord Broxbourne

My Lords, does London Regional Transport contemplate making any arrangements for the improvement of the stations in central London during the summer months when there is a great influx of tourist traffic which, while welcome in itself, brings great additional burdens to trains and stations?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, LRT is looking beyond the summer months. It is looking to improve all stations.

Lord Campbell of Croy

My Lords, will my noble friend suggest to London Regional Transport that it should put large notices outside stations where the escalators are not working so that those who cannot go for long distances down steps know that it is not worth going down?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I shall certainly convey my noble friend's point to LRT. I recall that a question on this matter was answered by my noble friend Lord Davidson last week.

Lord Mellish

My Lords, is the Minister aware that although I do not dispute his figures—I have no reason to do so—most Londoners regard London Transport bus services as absolutely lousy? What is he going to do about it?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, that is not true, I believe, if one looks at the figures of people using the buses. The number has increased from 1982 and is now slightly above the 1980 figure.

Lord Teviot

My Lords, with regard to the question of the noble Lord, Lord Mellish, about lousy services—a view with which I disagree—is my noble friend aware that London Transport, in trying to improve services, cannot do it all on its own because of traffic congestion? Is my noble friend satisfied that all is being done to try to enforce existing traffic regulations, and has he any plans for additional measures?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, it is because we see that improvements can be made that we are helping LRT through a substantial improvement in grant for capital investment of £216 million in 1986–87.