HL Deb 16 March 1983 vol 440 cc721-2

2.46 p.m.

Lord Oram

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they have modified their views about the closed shop now that the Gennard report has been completed.

The Minister of State, Northern Ireland Office (Lord Gowrie)

My Lords, Professor Gennard has not yet presented his completed report to the Department of Employment, although I understand that he expects to do so very shortly. When the report is received a copy will be placed in the Library of your Lordships' House.

Lord Oram

My Lords, is the Minister aware that I have received from the Library a closely-written, six-page summary of Professor Gennnard's report? Was that not available to the Minister in preparing his Answer to my Question? If I send him a copy, will he not appreciate that the employers who responded to Professor Gennard's inquiries showed by a majority that they saw more advantages than disadvantages in having closed shops because they provided improved industrial relations procedures; for example, by avoiding inter-union competition and increasing control over trade union membership?

The Earl of Gowrie

My Lords, speaking for myself, I prefer to await the report rather than a synopsis, and I have not read any synopsis; but I shall, of course, pay close attention to the report. As to whether employers prefer the closed shop or not, that would not seem to me to prejudge the issue of whether closed shops are desirable or not.

Lord McCarthy

My Lords, would the noble Earl agree that he is going to have to publish Gennard in the end? Would he not agree that it would be rather better if he could tell us now that the Government intend to publish Gennard as it is given to them, and not in any way to take out bits that might be contrary to their policy?

The Earl of Gowrie

My Lords, when I said that the report when it is received will be placed in the Library of your Lordships' House, I did not mean a Government synopsis of the report.

Lord Brockway

My Lords, in view of the fact that many large companies have indicated that they prefer the method of the closed shop, would the Government, in giving consideration to this proposal, consider allowing a conscience clause for those who do not wish to be members of a closed shop, provided that they give their subscriptions to charities instead of giving them to the trade unions?

The Earl of Gowrie

My Lords, when I have read the report I shall be happy to consider anything which may arise out of it. I would remind your Lordships that the legislation of the previous Government in relation to the closed shop was found to violate the European Convention of Human Rights; and I also have to pay attention to that.

Lord Glenamara

My Lords, will the noble Earl say whether the report deals with the closed shop in the two branches of the legal profession?

The Earl of Gowrie

My Lords, I am not able to say that because I have not yet read the report.