§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether, following the meeting of IATA (International Air Transport Association) in Montreal on 30th June and 1st July last and the subsequent issue of recommendations to member countries, they are now in a position to make a statement concerning the application of the overbooking compensation scheme to return flights resulting from an original booking made on airlines operating in the United Kingdom so that a passenger may be covered for the whole of his ticket and not as at present for half of it.
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, as my noble friend told the noble Baroness on 15th June, Her Majesty's Government remain of the view that more widely based arrangements for overbooking compensation should be implemented. The likeliest way of arriving at such arrangements would be for the industry itself to make them, and the Government hope that the recommendation of the European Civil Aviation Conference will help bring this about. I am informed that the meeting of IATA held in Montreal on 30th June and 1st July was held to discuss the future constitution and internal processes of IATA, not specific items such as overbooking.
§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords, having followed the discussions at the IATA Conference in Montreal and 420 having taken note of what was said to me on 15th June by the noble Baroness, Lady Stedman (col. 502, Official Report), I should like to ask my noble friend whether, in view of the very large-scale structure changes now taking place in IATA, it is not true that it will be possible for airlines in different countries to make bilateral or other agreements between themselves without having to secure the agreement of IATA countries? If that is so, can there any longer by any reason for delaying the implementation of the compensation on the whole of a ticket because some airlines do not agree?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, my noble friend is so much better informed than I am on this subject that I can hardly answer. I have a small note on this point somewhere. It would be for the Civil Aviation Authority to impose such conditions upon British carriers, if it thought fit. The Civil Aviation Authority takes the view, which the Government share, that a mandatory scheme applying to British carriers alone would be even less satisfactory than present arrangements and would give rise to considerable difficulties of implementation.
§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords, my noble friend's note is completely out of date and quite ineffective. Is he aware that he is very lucky to have only a small note?—I have a very large file. However, in all seriousness is he further aware that it is rather difficult—and I am sure that the Leader of the House will agree with me—for those of us who take a deep interest in these matters to receive continually ineffective Answers because noble Lords on the Front Bench are not sufficiently well briefed? Leaving that particular matter—
§ The LORD PRIVY SEAL (Lord Peart)My Lords, order, please ! Will the noble Baroness ask a question?
§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords, it was a question. Leaving that particular matter, may I ask my noble friend whether he is not aware that, following these discussions in Montreal, it is not for the Civil Aviation Authority or any other organisation to decide these matters? Is he further aware that IATA has now two main groupings 421 and the matters are to be left to individual airlines if they so wish? Therefore, will he look at the matter again, now that I have given him the correct information?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, I am filled with gratitude to my noble friend. Would not a subject of this complexity be better settled by an Unstarred Question or a minor debate?
§ Lord TREFGARNEMy Lords, is it not the case, however, that these matters can well be settled by means of bilateral negotiations between Governments? Is it not the case that all air services, although of course they have to have a licence from the Civil Aviation Authority, also have to have the approval of Her Majesty's Government and the other Government concerned? Therefore why cannot the Government bring pressure to bear where it is needed?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMYes, my Lords, the Government can bring pressure to bear, but unfortunately other organisations do not respond with the alacrity which some people would wish.
§ Lord DAVIES of LEEKMy Lords, is my noble friend aware that there are those of us who think that he has a profound knowledge, maybe on other subjects? Is he further aware that some of us do not feel that this noble House should be foisted off with half-baked Answers to Ministers at the Dispatch Box, who cannot be expected to be fully informed on these matters? Consequently, to say the the least, I take a dim view of some Answers that are given to a Minister who may not be expected to be fully informed. That is the Question and the bad feeling I have on it.
§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords. I wonder whether—
§ Lord PEARTMy Lords, I hope that the noble Baroness will ask a question this time.
§ Baroness BURTON of COVENTRYMy Lords, I never ask anything but questions. I should like to ask my noble friend whether he is aware that he is completely wrong? Is he aware that, 422 in view of the discussions at IATA in Montreal, it is not now for Governments to decide these matters; it has been agreed, in view of the changes, that they shall be decided by individual airlines without the agreement of the Governments concerned? Next time I put down a Question could I have a proper, authentic and correct Answer?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, assuming that I am to make the Answer, I hope that the noble Baroness will receive such an Answer, but I should like to have sufficient advance notice of what it is all about.
§ Lord HAILSHAM of SAINT MARYLEBONEMy Lords, is the noble Lord, Lord Winterbottom, aware that we have the greatest affection for him and we know very well that he is doing his best in a difficult situation?
§ Lord THOMASMy Lords, as a practising airline operator, may I say that it is quite wrong for airlines to be bullied into doing things that they automatically wish to do for themselves, which is to give the best possible service they can to their customers and so to attract more business.