HL Deb 24 July 1975 vol 363 cc435-7

3.24 p.m.

Lord WYNNE-JONES: My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government, in view of BP's recent affirmation of their agreement in principle to 51 per cent. State participation in their commercial oil discoveries on the United Kingdom Continental Shelf, how many companies have now agreed to 51 per cent. participation.

The MINISTER of STATE, DEPARTMENT of ENERGY (Lord Balogh)

My Lords, five companies with interests in commercial oilfields, including Burmah and BP, have announced publicly that they accept the principle of 51 per cent. participation. We are having constructive and detailed discussions with a substantial number of companies.

Lord WYNNE-JONES

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that Answer. Are Her Majesty's Government satisfied with the progress of negotiations with these companies? I understand the negotiations have been going on since January this year. Furthermore, can my noble friend say-whether Her Majesty's Government feel that the result of the negotiations will be of substantial benefit for the country, since at first sight it appears that the negotiations tend towards a financially neutral position between the parties concerned?

Lord BALOGH

My Lords, I can assure my noble friend Lord Wynne-Jones that our discussions have been extremely amicable and fruitful up to now. The delay has been partly caused by the fact that we were in intense negotiation and consultation with the companies about the oil tax, which I think has been accepted by the companies after some reassurance. Only today, we had assurances from one of the biggest companies. So far as the benefit to the country is concerned, there is a great deal of knowledge to be gained from possessing the oil and having direct title to it. We hope that these negotiations will be concluded within a tolerably short period. It seems to us much more important to reach an amicable conclusion, rather than have a hasty decision.

The Earl of LAUDERDALE

My Lords, can the noble Lord, Lord Balogh, say whether he regards the adjective "fruitful", which he used just now, as the right way to describe eight months of negotiations with a dozen or 15 companies, producing agreement with only one of them? Can he further tell us whether those companies with which, as he put it, constructive and, I think he said, amicable negotiations are now continuing, include the major companies such as Shell, Esso, Amoco, Conoco and Total?

Lord BALOGH

My Lords. I think the noble Earl, Lord Lauderdale, like the noble Viscount, Lord Massereene and Ferrard, is having difficulties with his statistics. There are five companies which have accepted the principle, not one. I think the noble Earl can be assured that no sort of pressure has been brought to bear on the companies. We have had amicable conversations, despite the fact that in this House the companies seem to have more vociferous expression than in a private chamber.

The Earl of LAUDERDALE

My Lords, I apologise to the noble Lord. Just to correct my supplementary question, when I referred to one company I meant one major company. Is it not the case that only one major company has fallen in with this ploy, and that all the others are minor companies?

Lord BALOGH

My Lords, I do not think the directors of Burmah would accept the description of their company by the noble Earl as a minor company.

Baroness WARD of NORTH TYNE-SIDE

My Lords, is the noble Lord, Lord Balogh, aware that the answer to the debate yesterday was a very bad one indeed?

Lord STRATHCONA and MOUNT ROYAL

My Lords, can the noble Lord tell us when he will be in a position to announce the details of the terms, and what their cost to the Exchequer will be?

Lord BALOGH

My Lords, without notice, I cannot give an answer to that question.

Lord STRATHCONA and MOUNT ROYAL

My Lords, the noble Lord has had eight months' notice.