§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, I do not know whether the noble Earl the Leader of the House or the noble Earl the Chief Whip can make a statement about business to-day. in particular about the domestic arrangements.
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, the Committee stage of the Industrial Relations Bill will be adjourned at 7 o'clock in order to take the Fire Precautions Bill, which I do not think will take very long, and we shall then resume consideration of the Industrial Relations Bill. Is the noble Lord really asking how late we are going to sit to-night? This is a little difficult to forecast at the moment. I am hoping that we may be able to conclude a reasonable number of Amendments before we rise, and perhaps we could discuss this through the usual channels.
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, would it be possible to give the House some indication of what is expected of it? If we are really going to embark on all-night Sittings, it would make a great deal of difference to the convenience of the House if some indication could be given as to what the Government hope to achieve during the course of the evening.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, I should certainly like to add my words to those of the noble Lord, Lord Byers. I think the noble Earl should remember that it is not only the convenience of noble Lords in the Chamber which should be considered. We have been supported by a most dedicated staff, and I am certain we should all like to pay a very great tribute to them, as they are working under terrible strain, and I think that strain is added to by the uncertainty as to when their hours will cease and in the 214 decision as to the methods by which they are to get home. I should have thought that the noble Earl would ease their particular burden, which I think is perhaps in some respects more important than that of noble Lords in this House, if he could be a little more forthcoming about the time and the position he is aiming for in this Bill.
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, usually when we have been dealing with long Bills of this sort it has been possible to have consultations through the usual channels and to be able, as a result of those consultations, to announce what the House hopes to do. If we can establish that I should be only too happy to acquaint the House and everybody else with the result of those discussions.
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, may I put it to the noble Earl that it would be useful if there could be an indication from the Government as to what they think is a reasonable target to achieve? And may I make a plea to the Opposition that they should do all they can within the powers of revising and improving the Bill, to try to hit that target by the time suggested?
EARL JELLICOEMy Lords. I should like to echo what the noble Lord, Lord Byers, has said. I fully recognise what is the convenience of the House.,; and I would endorse what the noble Lord, Lord Shepherd. has said about the staff. I think they have served us quite extraordinarily well these past weeks and I have already paid tribute to them, as has the noble Lord the Leader of the Opposition. But I am glad to take the opportunity of doing so again. My own feeling, in default of the normal consultation which we have had in the past on this sort of matter—and I fully realise the difficulties in the case of this contentious Bill—is that it would not be an unreasonable aim that we should be able to tuck Clause 58 under our belt by the time we draw stumps this evening or to-morrow morning.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, I am most grateful for that information. I intervened only because I could not accept on behalf of my noble friends an implied criticism of the noble Lord, Lord Byers. We on this side of the House have a job to do, and we intend to do it.
EARL JELLICOEMy Lords, both the noble Lord, Lord Byers, and I myself would like to echo those sentiments. Clearly this House has a very important job to do in connection with this Bill, and I think it is the duty of us all, and the inclination of us all, to do that job as thoroughly, within reason, as we can.
§ LORD ALPORTMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether, in view of the indication which came from the Opposition Front Bench, earlier this week or late last week, that there would be an opportunity for discussion through the usual channels in regard to a timetable, there has been any progress in regard to those discussions? Would not my noble friend agree that for the proper conduct and consideration of this Bill it is most important that discussions within this House should take place at a reasonable hour, when the Members of your Lordships' House are able to be here in reasonable numbers and when we are capable of dealing properly and thoroughly with subjects that were not properly discussed in another place. Would it not be possible to have an arrangement between the Government Front Bench and the Opposition for some timetable which ensures that we would be able to complement and carry out effectively the work on this Bill which has not been completed in the other House?
EARL JELLICOEMy Lords, the sentiments which my noble friends have expressed are those which are held by a great many Members of your Lordships' House. I can only re-echo what I said before: that we, for our part, are very open to discussions with the Opposition, and indeed with the Liberal Opposition, as to how most rationally our future debate on this Bill can be organised so that the House can acquit itself as I am sure we would wish to see it acquit itself in the discharge of its functions.
§ LORD WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, may I ask the Leader of the House whether the Refreshment Department has been asked to serve breakfast to-morrow morning?
EARL JELLICOEMy Lords, the precise position is that they have been asked to be prepared to serve breakfast.
§ LORD SLATERMy Lords, the noble Earl said that he expected to get to Clause 58. I think it would be as well to bring home to the noble Earl that, so far as this Bill has proceeded, Members on this side of the House cannot be charged with trying to filibuster on this particular Bill. As a result of the Guillotine procedure in another place, many of the clauses contained in this Bill were never debated there so that responsibility comes back on to this Chamber and the Members of this House.
EARL JELLICOEMy Lords, I note what the noble Lord, Lord Slater, has said, and I would have thought that there was nothing in my remarks this afternoon which bore any implication of filibustering. But perhaps, in the context of the Anglo-French talks which are due to take place very shortly, I can only add, in French: Qui s'excuse, s'accuse.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, would the noble Earl please translate that into English. I am not aware that foreign languages, even French, are permitted in your Lordships' House.
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, would it not be a reasonable translation to say, " If the cap fits— "?
LORD SALTOUNMy Lords, from time immemorial other languages, particularly Latin, have been permitted not only in your Lordships' House but in the Commons as well.