THIRLMERE RECREATIONAL FACILITIES (Hansard, 4 March 1971)

§ LORD WAKEFIELD OF KENDAL
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

§ THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE, DEPARTMENT OF THE ENVIRONMENT (LORD SANDFORD)
My Lords, I understand that none can be provided until additional treatment plant is installed some time after 1975.

§ LORD WAKEFIELD OF KENDAL
My Lords I thank the Minister for that reply, but it is rather similar to the replies we have been receiving from successive Governments for the last quarter of a century. Is it not possible to expedite the date? There is an increasing need for recreational facilities on stretches of water all over the country, particularly in the Lake District. It seems quite wrong that, not only on this Lake but other stretches of water, and catchment areas around them, public access for recreational facilities, camping and boating and so on, is still denied.

§ LORD SANDFORD
Yes, my Lords; my right honourable friend is very conscious of the need to make multiple use of reservoirs both for water supply and recreation, and has asked for reports from selected authorities with reservoirs about the recreational use that can be made of them. My noble friend raised the question about the use of the gathering grounds, and in this respect the Manchester Corporation has made considerable progress. There is a wide range of 1484 recreational facilities now available on them. As the list is rather long, I will circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT. They include, among other things, conducted tours round the waterworks.

§ LORD POPPLEWELL
My Lords, would not the noble Lord agree that 1975 is a very long time ahead? A great deal of information is already available as to the type of use that can be made of these waterways. Manchester has been very "sticky" about Thirlmere over a very long period of time. They relented slightly, and certain walks were agreed, but I would ask the noble Lord to press his right honourable friend to expedite the installation of plant from 1975 to 1973. Surely there is plenty of time, in view of the information already available.

§ LORD SANDFORD
My Lords, I take the point that the noble Lord is making, as I am sure will my right honourable friend. But in defence of Manchester perhaps I should say that although this is a programme provisionally arranged for Thirlmere, the noble Lord will bear in mind that they are making considerable progress with another reservoir, Hawes-water, and that the public will have access there when new treatment works go into operation in late 1972.

§ LORD AMULREE
My Lords, would not the Government agree that the real purpose of Thirlmere is to supply the inhabitants of Manchester with wholesome water, rather than supply recreational facilities for a few people who might want to go there?

§ LORD WAKEFIELD OF KENDAL
My Lords, are we to understand from that reply that, in view of the water now extracted or to be extracted from Ullswater and Windermere, recreational facilities are going to be denied to the public on those two lakes?

§ LORD SANDFORD
No, my Lords; on those two lakes work is already in hand to provide treatment, and I believe that the recreational facilities there are to be unaffected.

§ LORD BOWDEN
My Lords, would it not be possible to do something much more urgent than is now being suggested to make available access to the gathering grounds? There is an enormous area on the Western side of the Pennines 1485 and the Eastern end of Lancashire, an area which I believe is comparable in size to the whole of the Lake District, which has been totally destroyed as a potential recreation ground because of the demands, many years ago, for totally uncontaminated water. Farms have been allowed to become derelict, walls are falling down, and I think something ought to be done to make this enormous area available to the citizens of Manchester and of that part of Lancashire. Further, may I ask whether it would not be possible to arrange for some preliminary treatment of this area (for example, by reafforestation on a much larger scale than is at present contemplated) so that when it can be made available it will be a more pleasant place to go into than it is at the present moment?

§ LORD SANDFORD
My Lords, we are dealing with Thirlmere at the moment, and I have promised to publish in the OFFICIAL REPORT a long answer on what Manchester Corporation are doing about the gathering grounds there. Gathering grounds all over the Pennines is a rather wider question.