HL Deb 03 March 1971 vol 315 cc1338-40

2.57 p.m.

LORD ALLERTON

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether plans have been made to make the southern end of the M.1 into a three-lane road throughout.]

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

My Lords, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for the Environment is considering the result of a departmental study into the best means of providing additional capacity, or otherwise improving conditions for traffic, on the dual two-lane section of the M.1.

LORD ALLERTON

My Lords, while thanking my noble friend for that reply, may I ask him whether the accident rate on this particular stretch of road is higher than elsewhere on the M.1?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

My Lords, not having had notice of that question, I shall have to write to my noble friend.

VISCOUNT DILHORNE

My Lords, can the noble Lord give any estimate of the date when anything is likely to be done about that dual-carriageway?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

Yes, my Lords. We have the departmental study which the Secretary of State has in hand, and I would expect him to be able to reach a decision before the Summer Recess.

LORD ALLERTON

My Lords, may I further ask my noble friend whether it would be considered possible to restrict the lorries to the slow lane on the dual stretch of the carriageway?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

My Lords, that again is a rather wider matter. We all know that occasionally there is a very slow, heavy vehicle, and to stop all commercial lorries overtaking might create a larger block.

LORD BROCKWAY

My Lords, may I ask the noble Lord whether Her Majesty's Government accept in principle that three-lane roads are desirable on these main roads? If so, will he also look at the accident rate on the two-lane road between Slough and Maidenhead on the M.4, and bear that road in mind when consideration is being given to this matter?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

Yes, my Lords. The policy is that where it is justified three lanes are built, and in most cases where M-roads are now built three-lane dual carriageways usually are justified. The figure we use is where the flow is over 50,000 passenger car units per day; then the three-lane dual carriageway is justified. As your Lordships may know, we are already enlarging the M.4. This was a result of a study started in 1968 which will be finished this year.

LORD SLATER

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware that there is a consensus of opinion in this country that the three-lane road is the most dangerous so far as motorists are concerned, and that we ought to have more dual-carriageways?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

No, my Lords; I would not accept that at all. Our policy is to relate roads to the amount of traffic that they need to carry.

VISCOUNT HANWORTH

My Lords, does the Minister agree that it was a grave mistake, when constructing this stretch of road, not to make the bridges big enough to allow for expansion at a later date? Furthermore, will he see that this sort of error is not repeated in future projects?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

My Lords, it is very easy to say that with hindsight. The dual-carriageway was constructed at the time with the best traffic forecast available. We are perhaps now wiser about likely increases of traffic. By 1980 it is estimated that traffic will be some 56 per cent. higher than to-day, and this is taken into account in the construction of all new roads.

LORD SHACKLETON

My Lords, can the noble Lord tell us what is the difference between "passenger car units" and motor vehicles?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

My Lords, I thought the noble Lord the Leader of the Opposition might bowl me something like that. A passenger car unit is basically a car, but where you have a vehicle over 30 cwt. that is equal to 3 passenger car units; in other words, the larger the vehicle the more p.c.u.s.

LORD SOMERS

My Lords, would my noble friend agree that the important point is not whether the dual-carriageway has three lanes or two lanes, but that there is the changeover from three to two lanes in coming South; that traffic formerly travelling in three lanes has suddenly to converge into two lanes, which causes accidents?

LORD MOWBRAY AND STOURTON

Yes, my Lords; I think we are well aware of that.