§ 2.55 p.m.
§ LORD BESWICKI beg leave to ask Her Majesty's Government a Question of which I have given Private Notice. The question is: To ask Her Majesty's Government if they will make a statement on the future of the RB.211 engine?
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, with the leave of the House, my noble friend Lord Drumalbyn will answer this Question at a convenient moment after 3.30 o'clock.
May I take this opportunity to inform your Lordships that to ensure that there is ample time for consideration of the Immigration Bill on the Report stage it will almost certainly be necessary for the House to return after the Recess on Monday, October 11.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, we are grateful to the noble Earl for giving us notice of his intention with regard to future business. I am not sure whether the date he has given will be received with unalloyed enthusiasm. I think that some of us will regret that Her Majesty's Government have so arranged their legislative programme that so much is crammed into the end of the Session. Nevertheless, we note what the noble Earl says.
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, the noble Earl said"almost certainly ". May I ask when he will be able to confirm that it is definite, because it makes a lot of difference to our arrangements?
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, as I am sure the noble Lord will appreciate, various consultations are going on and it will obviously depend on the outcome of these. If the consultations are entirely satisfactory to everybody concerned, then probably it will not be necessary to return on October 11. If they are not, then we must allow sufficient time for the House to discuss those problems where satisfaction has not been reached.
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, I am sure that the noble Earl will agree that I accept his threat.
THE LORD PRIVY SEAL (EARL JELLICOE)My Lords, if, by leave of the House, I may intervene for a moment, I should like to take the opportunity to express my gratitude not only to your Lordships for the way in which your Lordships' have borne the heat and burden of this long summer—and it has been a hard slog for all of us—but also to all those who have helped to keep the House running day after day and night after night. I do not intend to indulge in self-congratulation so far as we are concerned. Therefore I wish to confine my brief remarks to those who have helped us in discharging our duties. I feel that we really owe a tremendous debt of gratitude to all members of the staff who have kept us going during these heavy past few months. We have placed a considerable strain on the Hansard team, the Doorkeepers and attendants, and indeed on all Officers of the House. I expect that all your Lordships will join with me in expressing our thanks to all those in the Refreshment Department who have kept us not only replenished but refuelled during our many late Sittings. I am sure that all noble Lords will agree that from all points of view we have been admirably looked after. In conclusion, since I detect a slight note of end-of-term in the atmosphere, I hope that I may be excused if I wish your Lordships a pleasant respite in the holiday season.
§ LORD SHACKLETONMy Lords, I cannot improve on the words of the noble Earl the Leader of the House. 1158 He certainly has spoken for us all and I will not repeat anything beyond saying this. May we also especially extend thanks to some of the staff who will be leaving us and wish them luck? I have particularly in mind Mr. Kemp, who has received the British Empire Medal, which is a proper recognition of his services, and many of those who work so well for us. May I also join in wishing the Government side, the Cross-Benchers, my own noble friends and the Liberals a peaceful holiday. And may I also include the noble and learned Lord who sits on the Woolsack?
§ LORD BYERSMy Lords, may I accept the condescension which the noble Lord the Leader of the Opposition has been good enough to confer upon us. I should like on behalf of my colleagues and myself to endorse everything which the noble Earl, Lord Jellicoe, has said about the staff. We have been looked after with a courtesy and a consideration, and, may I say, with a professionalism, which has made this place a much more tolerable place to work in than it might otherwise have been. We are very much indebted to them.
§ LORD BLYTONMy Lords, I should like to thank the staff, and to say to the House of Lords that I am pleased to have a respite from the most reactionary Government that we have had since 1926.
§ LORD LEATHERLANDMy Lords, if I might come down from the morning clouds to the hard facts, the Chief Whip told us that we should perhaps be returning on October 11. So that we may make arrangements, for how many days will this be? Will it be for one day or for the week?
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, that will depend on the amount of time your Lordships take to discuss whatever Amendments there happen to be on the Marshalled List.
§ LORD SLATERMy Lords, it is important to provincial Members, who have to find accommodation in London, having already made their arrangements for the 18th. Why is it so important that the Government should seek to press this Bill by bringing Members back? Now the noble Earl says that for how long we return all depends on the number of Amendments that are placed before the 1159 House on R eport and on Third Reading. Surely we have the right to the same facilities as are afforded to Members of another place, without being brought back in advance of their return?
EARL ST. ALDWYNMy Lords, I am sure the noble Lord is fully aware that legislation sometimes starts in another place, and sometimes here. The more controversial Bills tend to start in another place, and quite often they reach us rather late. This is a complaint which has been voiced by the Opposition for many years. We certainly voiced it in Opposition; noble Lords voiced it when we were in Government before; and I have little doubt that in due course we may find ourselves voicing it in Opposition again. Meantime, noble Lords are right to voice this objection, with which I may say I have great sympathy. But this Government, like any other Government, have a programme of legislation which they are anxious to complete before the House is prorogued. We could certainly come back on October 18, but it would mean that we should have to curtail discussion on this important Bill, which is the last thing the Government would wish to do. If, with the agreement of the Opposition, the Liberal Party and others, the discussion could be kept short, then we could come back on the 18th. But it seemed to me more important to warn your Lordships that there was a good chance of having to come back on the 11th, than to tell you that we were coming back on the 18th, and then later have to announce that we were coming back on the 11th.
§ LORD SHACKLETONMy Lords, I hope that we can leave the matter there. I should be inclined to make a protest were I not conscious of the fact that we treated the Party opposite equally badly when we were in Government.
§ LORD SLATERMy Lords, some of us have come from another place and other Members of your Lordships' House have not been there. My noble friend the Leader of the Opposition has commented on what the Government Chief Whip has said, but we do not entirely agree with his comments.