§ 2.48 p.m.
§ BARONESS BROOKE OF YSTRADFELLTEMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they are aware that, while the Public Lavatories (Turnstiles) Act 1963 has required the removal of all turnstiles in public lavatories provided by local authorities, such turnstiles still remain in lavatories provided for passengers' use at railway, coach and bus stations; and seeing that they are just as objectionable in the one place as in the other, what action is being taken to bring about their removal everywhere.]
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, the noble Baroness has already made her first speech from the Front Bench, but I believe this is the first Question she has put from there, and I think it will be a fearsome task for a Minister to reply. The subject of her Question is a matter of management for the various transport undertakings, which are under no statutory obligation to remove turnstiles. They have, however, assured my right honourable friend the Minister of Transport that they are taking the opportunity as it occurs to dispense with the old type of turnstile which is the cause of complaint.
§ BARONESS BROOKE OF YSTRADFELLTEMy Lords, while thanking the Minister for his reply, may I ask him whether the new prototype at New Street, Birmingham, is to be used throughout the rest of the country? If so, it is almost worse than the old turnstile; and it costs 6d. a time to use.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, the House will understand that I have no personal experience of that turnstile, but I shall look into that point. I believe there is some standardisation taking place, and I am not quite sure whether the complaint is really valid.
§ LORD BROCKWAYMy Lords, in view of the fact that it was the present Minister of Transport who first raised this issue, could she be pressed to see that this change is made on all the transport services.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, my right honourable friend is very keen on this matter. In fact, one of the supple-mentaries was in her own handwriting. I think it is right to say that there is now only one of the old turnstiles—the type about which there was so much complaint—left with British Railways, and that is the one at Cardiff General, which I gather is for the Gents. The new turnstiles are coming into use, but I shall certainly see that the noble Baroness's complaint is examined, to see whether it is valid. The private bus companies and those under the Transport Holding Company are removing the old turnstiles as rapidly as possible. As the noble Baroness will know, by law the municipal bus companies have to remove them all.
§ BARONESS EMMET OF AMBERLEYMy Lords, whereas, of course, it is easy to standardise some sort of reception or turnstile, it is impossible to standardise the size of the ladies going through it. Therefore the allowance must be a generous one.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, I will see that that point is conveyed to my right honourable friend.