§ 2.5 p.m.
§ THE EARL OF KINNOULLMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government, in view of the public decline in the habit of smoking, whether they will persuade the Railways Board to provide a greater proportion of nonsmoking compartments on the rail commuter services.]
§ THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE FOR COMMONWEALTH AFFAIRS (LORD BESWICK)My Lords, following the Statement on smoking in public places made by my right honourable friend the Minister of Health in another place on January 27, his Department wrote to the Railways Board asking them to consider whether further provision could be made for non-smoking travellers. The Board replied that, as a commercial undertaking, they must have regard to the requirements of their customers, but that they carried out very long surveys among passengers, and reviewed non-smoking accommodation on the various routes in the light of the views of passengers and the observations of railway staff. The ratio of non-smoking to smoking accommodation has been increased substantially in recent years in both main line and local trains in all areas. It is, of course, for the Board to decide on the amount of non-smoking accommodation.
§ THE EARL OF KINNOULLMy Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for that full reply, may I ask whether he would agree that the provisions that the Ministry have taken already are more than ever necessary?
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, the views of the Ministry are that cigarette smoking may be killing each year more than 6,500 men under the age of 55. An independent survey recently carried out states that the death rate for men cigarette smokers between the age of 25 and 65 is almost double that of the non-smokers. In the light of a situation of this kind I am sure the House will agree that it is necessary to try to do all that is possible to bring home the dangers to our fellow-citizens.
§ BARONESS BURTON OF COVENTRYMy Lords, would my noble friend not agree that the London Passenger Transport Board, in connection with the Underground railways, have increased the amount of non-smoking accommodation available because they found that the number of non-smokers was increasing? If this is correct, would he bring it to the attention of the Railways Board?
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, I think it is generally agreed that the number of non-smokers is increasing. In fact, I understand that 46 per cent. of the people in this country are now non-smokers. So far as the London Transport Board are concerned, they now find that the passenger requirement is for two out of each three coaches on their service to be non-smoking compartments. So far as the Southern Railway are concerned—the principal commuting railway, I suppose—in accordance with the wishes of their travellers they now provide 50 per cent. as non-smoking coaches.
§ LORD PLATTMy Lords, I am not sure whether this is a supplementary question or not, but are Her Majesty's Government going to do anything about smoking on aeroplanes? Many aeroplanes on short routes are divided into three compartments, in all of which people are smoking heavily during the whole of the journey.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, the difficulty is that the compartments are divided for reasons other than separating smokers from non-smokers. This is a vexed question, and the airlines have, I understand, been giving it considerable thought. They have not yet found a satisfactory way to divide the non-smoking sheep from the smoking goats.
§ BARONESS BURTON OF COVENTRYMy Lords, as we are ranging widely on these supplementary questions, may I ask my noble friend whether he can do anything to bring to the attention either of the Greater London Council or of the Government the question of smoking in cinemas, which is very objectionable to some people.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, this is an extremely interesting question. Again, this is, I understand, a subject on which there is a great deal of controversy. Experiments have been carried out by certain of the cinema proprietors but they have not yet devised a way of providing for a division between non-smoking and smoking sections and enforcing it.
§ LORD BLYTONMy Lords, would my noble friend take advice to see that those who smoke are not entirely eliminated from the passenger service?
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, I quite agree that those who smoke have every right, if they so wish, to expedite their journey to another place.