§ 3.10 p.m.
§ LORD BOSSOMMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they can state how many of the 265,000 immigrants who entered the United Kingdom and the Irish Republic during 1963 were already suffering from infectious, contagious or other diseases, such as syphilis, leprosy and so forth; whether they were allowed to enter the country and to circulate freely; and whether the Minister of Health is satisfied with this situation.]
§ THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDER-SECRETARY OF STATE FOR COMMONWEALTH RELATIONS AND FOR THE COLONIES (LORD TAYLOR)My Lords, statistics are not available about the health of immigrants who entered the United Kingdom in 1963, but 22 from the Commonwealth and 76 aliens were refused permission to enter on medical grounds. No information is available about those who went to the Irish Republic. As the noble Lord will know, my right honourable friend the Minister of Health has been concerned at the incidence of tuberculosis among some groups of immigrants and has introduced new measures, including the installation of X-ray equipment at London Airport, started under the last Government, where the majority of immigrants arrive. These new measures should help in the identification of per- 178 sons who should be refused permission to enter on medical grounds and in securing that those admitted who may require treatment are put in touch at an early stage with the medical services. The Minister is keeping the measures under review and will consider changes in them in the light of experience.
§ LORD BOSSOMMy Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for that comment, may I ask whether he is aware that these people ought to be medically examined and are not so examined to-day? What is the real answer to that?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, in the year about which the noble Lord inquired, of the estimated number (and I would stress that this is an estimated number, based on a sample survey only) of 265,000, 57,670 were examined. Only holders of Ministry of Labour vouchers and work permits, and those who are manifestly ill, are in practice medically examined.
§ LORD BOSSOMMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that lepers are not examined at all? They live among the poorest of our people here and spread leprosy, which is spreading all over the country much more than it should be.
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, the problem of leprosy in this country is a very small one indeed. All the cases of leprosy known are recorded in the leprosy register, and amount to 340. In all these cases, the disease is believed to have been contracted abroad, and I know of no case where it has been acquired in this country.
§ LORD WAKEFIELD OF KENDALMy Lords, can the noble Lord state what arrangements there are with the Irish Republic for dealing with immigrants from Commonwealth countries who may go into the Irish Republic and then, after a short stay there, come over here? What arrangements are there to prevent the avoidance of medical inspection which occurs now?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, I must emphasise that, in the normal course of events, the only people who can be medically examined are those who are manifestly ill or suspected of being ill, and holders of work permits or Ministry of Labour vouchers. Dependants are not normally medically examined at all. It is up to the port authorities to carry out 179 the necessary steps to stop passengers with contagious and infectious diseases. All the evidence is that they are carrying out their work properly, and that there is no excessive spread of any of the acute infectious diseases that may be brought in from abroad.
LORD INGLEWOODMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that Ministry of Agriculture officials do not examine only animals which are manifestly ill or suspected of being ill? The Ministry are very strict with these controls. Surely the Ministry of Health can be just as strict, when concerned with illnesses that could represent a very serious hazard to the people of this country?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, it really would be quite impossible and quite ridiculous to submit human beings to the same regulations as animals—for example, the quarantine to which dogs are subjected.
§ LORD NEWTONMy Lords, can the noble Lord say whether his right honourable friend the Minister of Health has given any thought to the possibility of inviting the dependants of immigrants voluntarily to be medically examined when they arrive?
§ LORD TAYLORI understand that this is done. Dependants are asked if they wish to be examined. But I think that the flow is such that it is not easy to do it. It is only fair to add that the Mountbatten Mission is considering, among other things, the question of the examination of immigrants at source.
§ LORD BALFOUR OF INCHRYEMy Lords, could the Minister explain the word "escalated", which seems to be a favourite word of the Establishment?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, I did not use that word. I said "estimated".
§ LORD BALFOUR OF INCHRYEI apologise, my Lords; as I get older, I get deafer.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, I understand from what the noble Lord has said that no X-rays are made of dependants suspected of having tuberculosis. Or are there such X-rays?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, if there is any reason to suspect that a dependant is suffering from tuberculosis, yes.
§ LORD LEATHERLANDMy Lords, as this Question refers to 1963, and as the circumstances and conditions we have heard of refer to that year, would my noble friend remind the House which Government was in office then?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, I do not think that I need remind the House which Government was in office. It is only fair to say that some of the information I have given refers to the present time—namely, the provision of X-ray facilities, which started under the last Government.
§ BARONESS HORSBRUGHMy Lords, surely it is correct to say that the arrangements for X-raying these people were started under the last Government?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, I have said so twice.
§ BARONESS HORSBRUGHMy Lords, I wanted it to be said a third time.
§ LORD BOSSOMMy Lords, can the noble Lord state how many people in this country are known to be suffering from leprosy?
§ LORD TAYLORMy Lords, I have already given the figure to the noble Lord—340.
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, we seem to have reached the point at which the same information is being asked for twice and three times, and I suggest that the House goes on to the next Question.