HL Deb 26 July 1965 vol 268 cc997-9

2.48 p.m.

LORD ELTON

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government when they expect to announce what conclusions they have come to in respect of immigration as a result of the Report of the Mission led by Earl Mountbatten.]

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, the Government intend to announce their policy for Commonwealth immigration before Parliament rises for the Recess.

LORD ELTON

My Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for that surprisingly encouraging Answer, may I ask him whether he realises that it would have been helpful to know the Government's intentions before we debated the Race Relations Bill, since obviously their action or inaction must affect, one way or the other, the psychological climate of the country—and the Bill is really concerned with the psychological climate? Does he also realises that all those who hope to see further restrictions on the present influx, which according to the evidence of the polls means the majority of the electorate, hope that the Government will spend as little time as possible either making up their mind or screwing up their courage?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I do not think it has ever been necessary, and nobody can suggest it has ever been necessary, for this Government to screw up their courage. I would, however, point out to the noble Lord that this matter is of such importance that it would be quite wrong to deal with it over-hastily; that we have had to have full regard to the Report of the vitally important Mission to the Commonwealth countries led by the noble Earl, Lord Mountbatten of Burma; and that if the Government's views and proposals on immigration are published before the Summer Recess there will be ample time to consider them before new legislation, if it should be necessary, is introduced.

VISCOUNT DILHORNE

My Lords, the noble Lord mentioned publication just before the Summer Recess. Will that be followed by action during the Summer Recess? Because it is very unfortunate that the House should have no opportunity, after these many months, of debating the Government's proposals. I am sure that many people would like action to follow upon these proposals if the proposals are generally acceptable. I ask the noble Lord: are we to wait until October and then have a debate before we have any action, or shall we get action during the Recess?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, as the noble Viscount is aware, in this matter two kinds of action are possible—administrative and legislative. He is further aware that administrative action has been taking place all the time. If there are further administrative steps which the Government think it advisable to take, and which do not require legislation, they will be taken; but I suggest to the noble Viscount that he awaits publication of the White Paper, when he will be able to judge for himself.

LORD DERWENT

My Lords, is it not very understandable that the Government are taking some time over this matter, in view of the fact that they have had completely to reverse their policy?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Derwent, is unusually ill-informed in this matter, because long before this Government took office we thought that an essential factor in change was full consultation with the Commonwealth countries. That full consultation has now taken place with the Commonwealth and with the Commonwealth Prime Ministers, and in our new proposals we shall be marching forward together with them. That is vitally different from what the noble Lord said.

LORD CARRINGTON

My Lords, is the noble Lord saying, or did my ears deceive me, that the Labour Party have not changed their policy on immigration?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I am quite sure that the ears of the noble Lord the Leader of the Opposition did not deceive him—they seldom do. I was answering his noble friend's question; and, if he will look at my answer tomorrow he will see that I gave a complete answer to it, so there should be no misunderstanding.

LORD ALPORT

May I ask the noble Lord whether the timing is intended to ensure that no legislation is necessary until after the next Election?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I am sorry; I did not hear the first part of the noble Lord's question.

LORD BROCKWAY

My Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether it is not the case that in the Labour Party's Amendment to the original Act there was a declaration that we should reach agreement with the Commonwealth countries? Is he aware that we all welcome the fact that such consultations have taken place, but will he provide some opportunity before the Recess, if a Statement and a White Paper are to be issued, for the House to discuss them?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, it is perfectly true, and known by everyone in the House, that we insisted on consultations. With regard to the finding of time for a debate, that is not a matter for me.

LORD CARRINGTON

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware, or is he not, that the Labour Party opposed the Second Reading of that Bill in the other place—and, in fact, all stages?

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I am perfectly well aware—

LORD CARRINGTON

It does not sound like it.

LORD STONHAM

Would the noble Lord like to finish his question?

SEVERAL NOBLE LORDS

Go on!