§ THE EARL OF ALBEMARLEMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the presence in this country of Professor Leakey, an initiate eider of the Kikuyu tribe, and a member of the Kikuyu Land Commission of 1929, has enabled them to sort out the misunderstandings which arose in the Crown grants of land to settlers which either alienated tribal territory or individual Bantu ownerships bought from the Wanderobo tribe and others.]
§ THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR COLONIAL AFFAIRS (THE EARL OF PERTH)My Lords, the Kenya Government is not aware of any specific claim by the Wanderobo tribe in respect of any former Wanderobo land alienated to Europeans or sold to Kikuyu and subsequently alienated to Europeans. All such land claims were exhaustively investigated by the Kenya Land Commission which reported in 1934. As a result of the recommendations of the Commission, a number of adjustments 909 were made, in some cases by the allocation of land and in others by payment of cash compensation. It may interest your Lordships to know that the Kenya Government has defined certain areas in which the interests of a particular tribe will be given priority for the purpose of settlement under the Kenya Government's proposals for accelerated land settlement which are at present under consideration by Her Majesty's Government.
§ THE EARL OF ALBEMARLEMy Lords, I beg to thank the noble Earl for his Answer. But is he not aware that land titles are not secured, in the opinion of the settlers. By September in the Southern hemisphere settlers have to make their subsequent year's cropping plan, and until there is some certainty of their titles being recognised by the African majority existing to-day they cannot be expected to put their best foot foremost, and in fact some of them will want to go. Lastly, are the Government not aware, therefore, that it is necessary to set up a compensation fund for settlers—as necessary as it has been for 300 expatriate civil servants in Kenya?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I am aware, and I think your Lordships are all aware, of the anxiety of certain of the settlers in regard to their land titles; but we have again and again said that we do not think that these anxieties are well-founded. At the present time there is a proposal for all parties, particularly the two African parties, to meet under the chairmanship of the Governor to discuss any questions of land and land property rights. While that subject is being discussed I think that there is nothing more at this moment I can say to answer the noble Earl on that particular point, while understanding very well the anxieties that he has expressed.
§ THE EARL OF ALBEMARLEI thank the noble Earl for his kind answer.
VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLS-BOROUGHMy Lords, I hope that when we come to more detailed consideration of this matter we shall have some regard to the dates of acquirement of the land titles. They will be very varied in the last 40 years.
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I do not believe that the question in dispute is, in fact, so much one of land 910 titles. The general question of property is something which is going to be under discussion. But the view of Her Majesty's Government and of the Kenya Government is quite clear—namely, that the question of land titles, whether or not of land alienated in one way or another from the tribes, was one which was gone into most exhaustively in 1934 at the time of the Carter Commission. At that time various measures were taken to meet many of the claims, and subsequently titles were confirmed under the laws of 1939.