§ 2.35 p.m.
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the first Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the plans of the proposed building at Piccadilly Circus which the London County Council submitted to the Royal Fine Art Commission in February, 1959, disclosed the fact that the building was to be surmounted by a rotatable crane.]
THE JOINT PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY, MINISTRY OF AGRICULTURE, FISHERIES AND FOOD (EARL WALDEGRAVE)My Lords, I understand that no plans submitted by the applicant to the Council, or by the Council to the Commission, have included a crane.
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, may I thank my noble friend for that Answer and assure him that I was not suggesting that the crane was any more disreputable than the rest of the building?
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the second Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the London County Council have yet submitted to the Royal Fine Art Commission plans of the improved elevation of the lower part of the proposed building at Piccadilly Circus, which they agreed to be necessary to meet the Commission's criticism.]
1028EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, I understand that as yet the London County Council have not themselves received from the developers the revised plans which, among other things, will incorporate the modification to which this Question refers. The answer to the Question is therefore, No. It is hoped that the revised plans will be ready in time for them to be made available for inspection by members of the public a day or two before the public local inquiry, which is to be held into this scheme, and which is starting on December 16.
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, I thank my noble friend for that Answer. Does it not follow that he was a little premature on November 17 when he said that the criticisms of the Royal Fine Art Commission on this part of the building had been met? Does it not follow from the Answer he has now given that the plans of the building which will be the subject of a public inquiry as early as the 16th of this month have not yet been made public?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, I do not think that I can add anything further to my reply. With respect, I suggest that it would be advisable to limit our discussion of questions on this matter to-day, as this inquiry will be taking place on December 16.
§ THE EARL OF SWINTONMy Lords, arising out of that Answer, may I ask the Minister, if this inquiry is going to take place so soon, who is going to represent the public interest at the inquiry? In your Lordships' House and elsewhere all Members represent the public and its point of view in matters of interest. Who is going to represent the public interest at this inquiry in the way the Attorney General sometimes acts as amicus curiae? Will the Royal Fine Art Commission or some trust, or some body representing the public interest, be there to represent the views that have been so widely canvassed in both Houses?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, I should be happier if I had had notice of that Question, which hardly arises out of the detailed Question on the Order Paper. The public is represented at this inquiry, and I understand that any member of the public or any organisation 1029 representing the public has a full and perfect right to be represented at the inquiry.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, but are we to understand that the public will see the revised plan only two or three days before the public inquiry takes place?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, my information is that the plans will be available to the public before the inquiry takes place.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYBut how long before?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, I am afraid that I cannot give the noble Marquess a precise answer to that question.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, I put it to my noble friend that we have a right to know in this House how long it is going to be. If it is going to be only two days, on a matter which requires careful and detailed discussion by architects, experts and others, ought there not to be more time given? And would it not be worth while postponing the inquiry for a few days to see that adequate time was afforded?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, I should not like to express an opinion on the question of postponing the inquiry without consulting my right honourable friend. If a Question on exactly how long the plans would be available before the inquiry had been on the Order Paper, of course, it would have been answered. I will convey this question to my right honourable friend at once and seek to give the information that is required.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, if I were to put down a Private Notice Question, as a matter of urgent public importance, for to-morrow, would the Government be able to answer it?
EARL WALDEGRAVEMy Lords, if a Question is put down for to-morrow, I am sure that my right honourable friend will do his best to answer it.