PICTURES FOR BRITISH EMBASSIES (Hansard, 29 May 1951)

§ THE EARL OF MUNSTER
My Lords, I beg to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

§ THE PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY, MINISTRY OF WORKS (LORD MORRISON)
My Lords, the numbers of pictures sent for display in the official houses of British Ambassadors in foreign countries are as follows: from the National Gallery, 6; from the Tate Gallery, 75; from other public galleries and museums, 11; from private ownership, 33; making a total of 125. I must apologise to noble Lords for an error in a supplementary answer given on May 9. The eighty-one pictures mentioned in the reply represent those pictures on loan from the National Galleries under Section 1 (1) (b) of the National Gallery (Overseas Loans) Act, 1935, and do not include those on loan from private owners. I should like to repeat that the Government would be very glad to borrow pictures from private owners for use in Embassies and other Government buildings overseas. A few owners have very generously lent pictures, and this has been of great assistance to the Ministry of Works in furnishing Mission Houses abroad. I should like to add that the reference made, in reply to a question on May 9, to the disappointing results of this appeal was not intended in any way to refer to loans from the public galleries and museums, who have been most generous in their assistance.

§ THE EARL OF MUNSTER
My Lords, I am obliged to the noble Lord for the full and ample reply he has given, but there are two supplementary questions which I should like to ask. First, is it not possible for His Majesty's Government to decide now whether they would be prepared to extend the Act of 1935 to cover the houses of Governors-General? Secondly, is it not a fact that there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of pictures which the British public never see both in the National Gallery and in the Tate Gallery, which could quite easily be sent for display in the houses of British Ambassadors?

§ LORD MORRISON
My Lords, I am afraid that I cannot give a very certain answer to the last supplementary question; I have not sufficient knowledge of 873 the pictures in question. I will, however, endeavour to see that a satisfactory reply is sent to the noble Earl. With regard to the noble Earl's first supplementary question, I can inform him that discussions are in contemplation by the interested Departments in regard to the possibility of extending the powers of the national art galleries to lend works of art to British Government buildings overseas. As the noble Earl knows, fresh legislation, though perhaps minor legislation, would be needed, and it is on that subject that discussions are taking place.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
My Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for his answer to my noble friend's supplementary question, I should be grateful—and I am sure other noble Lords feel the same—if the answer with regard to the numbers of pictures in the National Gallery, the Tate Gallery and other public galleries which are not shown to the public could be given by way of oral answer in this House, rather than privately to the noble Earl. At the present time, as the noble Earl has said, there is a strong impression in this country that there are large numbers of pictures which are not shown and that, so far from these galleries being generous in their attitude, it has been extremely difficult to extract any pictures at all from them. I am not blaming anybody—indeed, the impression may be incorrect. But I suggest that it would be right that Parliament should know exactly, or as nearly as possible, what pictures there are in public hands which are not at present being shown.

§ LORD HARLECH
Arising out of that point, and before the noble Lord's reply, may I urge that it is most undesirable to send to foreign countries inferior examples of British art? Admittedly, we still want on the walls of the National and Tate Galleries the finest of our own national products. They have to compete with foreign products in that sphere. When I was in the Office of Works, a difficulty I experienced was in getting for a place like Paris pictures adequate in quality to justify their hanging in the British Embassy in Paris. Another problem I met in carrying out my work in the 874 Office of Works was the great difficulty of temperature. Pictures sent to the tropics have to be specially selected and prepared, otherwise they are liable to undergo serious deterioration. One must always remember that a very large pro-portion of the pictures in the vaults of the National and Tate Galleries are not pictures bought by the nation, but are pictures bequeathed to the nation by—

§ LORD HARLECH
Will the noble Lord bear that point in mind in any legislation which he brings forward?

§ LORD MORRISON
I will certainly bear in mind what the noble Lord has said. With regard to the supplementary question of the noble Marquess, Lord Salisbury, perhaps the simplest way would be if the noble Earl, Lord Munster, who has previously taken part in this matter, were to put down a Question to which I would endeavour to give a complete answer.

§ LORD WINSTER
Might I ask the noble Lord, Lord Morrison, whether, when he is considering this matter, he will also bear in mind Government houses abroad, as well as the houses of Governors-General, as mentioned by the noble Earl, Lord Munster? In Government houses abroad which I have seen, the walls are either completely bare or else are occupied by very indifferent daubs indeed, while at the same time our galleries at home have a great number of pictures which they are unable to exhibit to the public. I ask the noble Lord if he would kindly consider the question of making available from the national collections pictures for the houses of Governors of British Colonies as well as for the houses of Governors-General.

§ LORD MORRISON
I can only add to the answers I have already given that, if the discussions which I have mentioned should be successful in getting unanimity of desire in all parts of the House, a small amending Bill could be introduced. No doubt when that amending Bill is presented there will be time to decide upon these points.