§ 2.40 p.m.
THE EARL OF CORK AND ORRERYMy Lords, I beg to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask His Majesty's Government whether there is any intention to raise pensions and allowances of the dependants of members of the Armed Forces so as to avoid the necessity of appeals to the charitable public when some disaster occurs whereby many lives are lost, e.g., the "Affray."]
THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY (LORD PAKENHAM)My Lords, the generous-minded public of this country will always be so moved by a national disaster, particularly at sea, that they will wish to start funds for the dependants of the victims without regard to the provisions which may be made from official sources. In the case of the tragic loss of the "Affray," all widows and dependants receive pensions at the same rates as for war pensions.
THE EARL OF CORK AND ORRERYMy Lords, before I ask a question arising out of that answer, may I be permitted to congratulate the noble Lord who has just replied on his appointment as First Lord of the Admiralty? I am sure that the Navy as a whole will regret the departure of Lord Hall, but as that had to be, I am glad that his mantle has descended upon the shoulders of Lord Pakenham.
1005 Arising from the noble Lord's answer, may I say that I do not know whether the Government have taken into consideration the object of my question, which is to draw attention to the large number of men of the three armed Services who die on active service every month. If the dependants of the men of a submarine who die get a fund of something like £80,000, it creates a tremendous inequality between them and the dependants of men who die on other service. Three or four lines in a news-paper can make all the difference. I wonder whether something cannot be done to establish equality in these matters. I would go further and ask the Government whether they have taken into consideration the fact that the pensions and allowances which are now given in respect of men who die on service are of the 1946 vintage. I suggest that they should be brought more into line with the rates of pay now given to active service ratings and others.
LORD SALTOUNMy Lords, before the noble Lord answers that question, may I ask a supplementary question? If it is the same as that asked by my noble and gallant friend, I beg your Lordships' pardon, because I could not hear him. I should like to ask whether His Majesty's Government have in mind that when there occurs a disaster, such as that of the "Affray," everybody extends help because the happening is news through-out the country; but men die in the same way on countless occasions which are not brought so immediately to public attention, and yet the circumstances of the survivors' widows and children are exactly the same.
LORD PAKENHAMMy Lords, may I begin by venturing to remind the two noble Lords that the Government recently reviewed the whole question of war pensions and decided not to increase the basic rates but to make certain improvements in supplementary allowances amounting to £630,000 a year. The House will remember that these changes were announced on April 17, and they become effective this week. Both noble Lords, with infinitely greater experience of the sea than I have or am ever likely to have, have raised various points in their supplementary questions which I should, of course, wish to discuss with them in due course, but I do not want to suggest 1006 that any change of policy is possible at this time. May I conclude by thanking the noble and gallant Earl in particular, and many other noble Lords who have supported him, for the kind welcome which has been given me? I certainly feel that mine is one of the most honourable tasks that could fall to any member of your Lordships' House, and it is certainly very difficult to live up to its great traditions and, in particular, to try to achieve what Lord Hall achieved. I am grateful to all your Lordships, and I will, of course, do my best.
THE EARL OF CORK AND ORRERYMay I ask one further question? Are the new allowances to be retrospective?
LORD PAKENHAMMy Lords, I am afraid I am not quite certain. They become effective this week and so I am afraid I must assume that they are not retrospective. If I am incorrect in saying that, I will advise the noble and gallant Earl.