§ THE LORD ARCHBISHOP OF CANTERBURY moved to resolve, That in accordance with the Church of England Assembly (Powers) Act, 1919, this House do direct that the Clergy Pensions (Older Incumbents) Measure, 1930, be presented to His Majesty for the Royal Assent. The most rev. Primate said: My Lords, if the noble Lord, Lord Olivier, felt that it was intolerable to make a speech at this late hour and in this not very crowded House, how much more intolerable must it seem at a later hour, and in a smaller House, to bring forward a Measure dealing with so complicated a matter as pensions? But I am reluctant to adjourn the matter because I am very anxious that this Measure should receive the Royal Assent at the earliest possible opportunity. Therefore I feel bound to pursue my Motion, that the Clergy Pensions (Older Incumbents) Measure, 1930, be recommended to His Majesty for the Royal Assent. I can do so, I think, in very few words. I might, indeed, suppose that no one here was likely to oppose the Motion, but I am always so anxious that these Measures should receive attention in this House, and not be re- 429 garded as mere matters of form, that I hope, you will allow me in a very few words to explain its purpose.
§ As you are aware, I think, at long last the Church of England has been able to secure a pensions system for all its clergy—at least a system which will reach them all in due course of time. Unfortunately, from that pensions system, secured by the Pensions Measures which have hitherto passed the House, the older incumbents, the men who were 55 before January 1, 1927, are excluded. This Measure comes to their aid. At present the only sources from which they can get any pension are, in the first place, the Incumbents' Resignation Acts, in many ways most indefensible, which entitle a man, if the Commission appointed to consider it thinks fit, to receive a pension charged upon the income of his benefice, and paid by his successor, and in the second place, a grant of £75, hitherto administered as a bounty by the Ecclesiastical Commissioners, and now administered by the Church of England Pensions Board, or Pensions Authority. These sources are in many ways uncertain. In the case of the Incumbents' Resignation Acts there is no certainty that any particular pension will be allotted. It depends upon the discretion of the Commission, limited only by the fact that no pension can exceed one-third of the benefice, and the clergyman has to sign his resignation before he knows exactly what pension he is likely to receive. Moreover, he has to declare that he is permanently incapacitated by physical or mental infirmity from discharging his duties, and many elderly men find it difficult to persuade themselves that that is true, or to persuade their family doctor to believe it, when all that is the matter is that they are getting a little old.
§ This Measure sets the older incumbent free from these uncertainties and restrictions, and ensures a regular and definite system of pensions, by stabilising the matter and providing a sliding scale by which every older incumbent who retires from old age knows exactly how much he will receive, and also ensures for him that £75 a year which has hitherto been given as a matter of course though not of right. The long and short of it is that while pensions will vary in pro- 430 portion to the value of the benefice, no one will get less than £150 a year, and what is even more valuable no benefice of under £300 a year can ever be charged under the Incumbents' Resignation Acts with a pension. Even this will require a certain amount of new money, and it shows how difficult and important these matters are when I inform your Lordships that it is calculated that £1,250,000 will be necessary, or periodic payments extended over a period of years to that, amount, if even this modest Measure can be satisfactorily financed. But I am glad to say that the Ecclesiastical Corn missioners are prepared, without sacrificing existing and most beneficial schemes, to shoulder that burden.
§ The clauses of the Measure merely give effect to these provisions. They have been most carefully considered by the Pensions authorities, by the Ecclesiastical Commissioners, and the Church Assembly. The Ecclesiastical Committee of Parliament is anxious that this Measure should go through, and I am particularly anxious it should do so at once, so that the appointed day can be July 1, 1930, as a great number of the older incumbents are anxiously waiting to know whether by that date they are able to retire. I am sorry myself that it is still necessary to prolong even for a few years the Incumbents' Resignation Acts, but, after all, they are improved in their administration by this Measure. They are limited in their operation to parishes that are over £300 a year, and their continuance is only temporary until the pensions' scheme already secured for all the clergy can be extended to those who were over 55 in 1927. For these reasons I hope your Lordships will be pleased to pass this Motion.
§ Moved to resolve, That in accordance with the Church of England Assembly (Powers) Act, 1919, this House do direct that the Clergy Pensions (Older Incumbents) Measure, 1930, be presented to His Majesty for the Royal Assent.—(The Lord Archbishop of Canterbury.)
§ On Question, Motion agreed to.
§ House adjourned at ten minutes past seven o'clock.